CODOH Watch

Updates on More Smear & Bitching

2010-04-25T07:38:00.001-07:00

Update 1: See my RODOH posts 12163, 12164 and 12165

Update 2: Mr. Lisciotto's characteristic reaction [screenshot].

Question of the day: could it be that renowned Holocaust researcher Chris Webb doesn't know that his associate is barking mad? (That will cause said associate to put together another smear blog and/or a litany of fake comments on the current one, stay tuned.)

Update 3: See my RODOH posts 12189, 12190 and 12191.

Smear-blog-toting coward Carmelo Lisciotto is so predictable ...

More smear & bitching on CODOH (Part 1)

More smear & bitching on CODOH (Part 2)

More Smear & bitching on CODOH (Part 2)

2010-04-24T10:39:00.001-07:00

More smear & bitching on CODOH (Part 1)

In his post of Thu Apr 22, 2010 6:34 am, occasional CODOH poster "Karl Radl" produced the following smear:

I apologise for going slightly off-topic, but I wished to add a short personal testimony about Roberto's 'habits'. When my wife went to Poland with a film crew nearly a year ago and Roberto claimed he was going to meet her at one of the Reinhardt camps [I forget which off hand] only for her (and the rest) to get stopped, detained and deported by the Polish police who knew she was coming, knew where she was going, why she was going there and more precisely her name [the former three things are ones that Roberto was one of the only person outside of our family and those we employed to knew about it (whom I have good reason to trust)]. Roberto also made an attempt to claim she 'threatened him' (specifically when he claimed that she was 'going to get him beaten up by skinheads') and our attorney advised her after reading his message that he was angling for a dubious comment or two for him to sue her (as myself and my wife are not poor).

Roberto then claimed she didn't show and that he had won the bet/challenge. You can't prove it was him tipping off the Polish authorities, but it is one of those bits of circumstantial evidence that are suggestive as opposed to conclusive.

These claims are obviously related to my trip to Sobibor from 14 to 16 October 2008. On 15 October I was supposed to meet there with my old friend Greg Gerdes and with a lady who posted on the VNN thread Archaeological Investigations of Treblinka as "Eireann Goddess" (hereinafter "EG"). This lady is obviously the "wife" that "Karl Radl" is referring to.

Neither Gerdes nor EG showed up for our appointment, as I pointed out in my VNN post 1525, written on 16.10.2008 from Wlodawa, Poland.

Greg Gerdes, despite the threatening invective he had sent my way and his bigmouthed challenge to German authorities (see his post 1514: "I publicly challenge the P.O.S. Stasi bastards in Gewmany to put out an arrest warrant for me - ala Toben. Got that you shabbas goy MF's? I DARE YOU.") eventually got cold feet and decided to stay at home. In his post 1521 he claimed that fear of being apprehended had prompted his decision:

Boy, someone would have to be really really stupid to actually think that I would go to Europe after what happened to Toben.

But wait, slamin sam is really really stupid.

Uhmmmm, never mind.

EG, whose last message prior to my trip to Sobibor was her post 1499 (to which I responded in my post 1506), didn't give any reasons for not having shown up. In fact I never heard of her again.

Neither in EG's aforementioned post nor in any previous post that I remember did EG reveal her identity, so it's a mystery to me how I am supposed to have known her name, as "Karl Radl" claims.

As to the "beaten up by skinheads" – thing, KR must be referring to my VNN post 1492, where in response to EG's post 1482 I wrote the following (emphasis added):

Trying to scare me off, baby?

You should have come up with a better story, then. Like some of your NS thugs waiting for me on site to cut my throat. But then, even that wouldn’t impress me.

Of course I think you’re talking a lot of shit here. I don’t think you have contacts with the Polish government, let alone contacts who can assure you that you can’t be bothered for Holocaust denial. And while it seems plausible that you run around with a bunch of NS bodyguards, it’s rather hard to believe that you have an attorney in Poland or accompanying you on your trips into Poland. That is, unless you’re the spoilt rich kid of some Jew-hating moneybags like Willis Carto or the late Robert H. Countess. I also doubt that you are willing to forfeit your treasured anonymity, which you will have to do when meeting me.

But OK, let’s assume it’s not all just bullshit and you will actually be there. In that case I also assume that you will show your face on that video and duly identify yourself, for I won’t consent to being filmed by or together with an anonymous coward. I further assume that you will hand me a copy of that video, and that any public use you make thereof will require my prior consent, just like any public use I make of the video will require your prior consent. I also assume that you will hand me a copy of that video, and that any public use you make thereof will require my prior consent, just like any public use I make of the video will require your prior consent.

When we have properly introduced each other, we can go visit the site and photograph or film any bone fragments or other human remains we may come across. I don’t think the Polish government will object to photographing or filming such objects, provided that we leave them where they are, which of course is my intention. But if they have a problem with that, I’m sure museum director Marek Bern will tell us so and we’ll have to cancel that part of the program.

Needless to say, I don’t exclude the possibility that instead of EG & friends I will meet only a bunch of Polish skinheads or other scum with intentions against my life or personal integrity. It’s nothing that I would put beyond the bloodthirsty little thing. In case that happens, I’ll leave word with people I trust about who is to be held responsible for anything that might happen to me. It would be you as instigator, with Gerdes and PS as possible accomplices.

That said, I look forward to meeting you on 15.10.2008, 10 hours local time, at this place:

[photo of the Sobibor memorial entrance]

As becomes apparent from the above-quoted post, and as can be confirmed by the persons I left word with before departing, I did not know EG's identity at the time. I still don't. So there's no way I could have reported her to any Polish authorities, even if I had known what authorities to turn to and what to report to them, and if I had the inclination to hide from an appointment behind authorities (which, unlike Greg Gerdes, I don't have). As to EG’s supposed travel itinerary, all I knew was that "We will be near Sobibor on the 15th.", as EG had claimed in her post 1482.

All this suggests that KR is either lying or was lied to by his wife, if indeed EG is his wife.

A further indication of mendacity is EG's utter silence when I reported that she had not shown up and Slanim2 followed up with the following remark, in his post 1528:

Roberto kept his word and arrived on time, you showed yourself to be a liar, once again, I wonder what EG's excuse will be.

That would have been the time for EG to claim that she had been held up and turned back by Polish authorities, if indeed such had happened.

But the lady’s silence was deafening.

So the story that her supposed husband all of a sudden comes up with now, about 18 months after my trip to Sobibor, carries a distinct smell of fish, to say the least.

KR’s smear is followed up by some more of jnovitz/lgr’s bitching, which I don't think I need to comment anymore after having shown our readers that the fellow is a inveterate liar. If the resentful old fart should feel like "poking fun" about me at some other place, I'll find out soon enough and go there to pull his bunny ears a little more. As to the petition he is mouthing off about, it is this one:

A Petition to the German Legislator

The more of our readers sign it, the bigger the chance that it will one day go where it is meant to go.

More smear & bitching on CODOH (Part 1)

2010-04-24T08:34:00.001-07:00

Kevin Barrett's invitation to a radio debate with Mr. "Dalton" launched some bitching fish-wives on the CODOH Cesspit into an instructive festival of mendacious insinuations, paranoid and somewhat-less-than dishonest suspicions and downright lies about my humble person. In the following I shall have a look at these lowly characters' deplorable utterances, one by one.

First we have my good old friend "Drew J", who in his post of Thu Apr 22, 2010 2:22 am on the thread Dear Andrea Merkel: How much do Raul Hilberg and I owe you? let fly as follows:

Now that's interesting as Roberto has attacked Dalton so many times on his blog. You do know that Roberto will say, "I have already countered Dalton's points on the net so he has to respond to me first. Me not debating him is being turned into me being a chicken by him when he is the chicken for not responding to my posts to his work on my blog." And I think that there is something to this would be stance of Roberto's. I suspect Roberto will ONLY come onto Dalton's show if Dalton promises to let Roberto talk about the issues where he disagrees with Dalton that Roberto already brought up on his blog. After all, if presumably, Dalton never responded to Roberto's critiques, the radio would probably be an acceptable venue for Roberto if Dalton promised he'd deal with Roberto's counters on his blog straight on AND NOTHING ELSE on the radio show.

Actually I followed up my previous blog with the following mail to Kevin Barrett, sent on Wed, April 21, 2010 11:23:06 PM:

An invitation to Mr. "Thomas Dalton"
...
From:
Guadalupe Salcedo [Chat now]
...
View Contact
To: truthjihad@gmail.com; kbarrett@merr.com
Hi Mr. Barrett,

The above is the title of a blog I just wrote on the Holocaust Controversies blog under http://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2010/04/invitation-to-mr-thomas-dalton.html , after I learned of your claim to have invited me to a debate with Mr. "Thomas Dalton".

I don't remember having received any mail from you, but maybe I did and inadvertently deleted it because I thought it was spam (as I said in the blog, I only learned of your existence today). So if you did send me a mail, could you please forward it again for my records? Thanks!

As you seem to be in contact with Mr. "Dalton", I would also appreciate if you could inform him of my invitation in the aforementioned blog. Needless to say, you are also invited to have a chat with me on the Usenet, the RODOH Forum, the VNN forum or any other online venue of your choice, provided that I have access to such venue and debate there is not curtailed by a moderator like it is on the "CODOH Revisionist Forum". Just let me know when and where.

Best regards,

Roberto Muehlenkamp

Kevin’s reply, received on Thu, April 22, 2010 2:04:10 PM, was the following:

Fwd: radio invitation, re: holocaust revisionism debunking
...
From:
Kevin Barrett
...
View Contact
To: Guadalupe Salcedo
Cc: Andrew Mathis
Hello Roberto,

Great to hear from you! Below is the message I sent Monday to robert.muehlenkamp@lis1.siemens.pt, webmaster@holocaust-history.org

I'm actually a free-speech-fanatic radio host and 9/11 revisionist, not a holocaust revisionist, and certainly not an online-forum debater on that topic! Since I posted the blog entry you saw, I got in touch with Andrew Mathis, who will rebut Dalton during the second hour of Saturday's show IF we can get him Dalton's book in time (working on it - the publisher will overnight him the book as soon as they get a snailmail address). Meanwhile, are you also available this Saturday, 11-midnight GMT, in case for some reason Andrew can't do it?

Sorry about the email address mixup. I probably should have invited you earlier, instead of concentrating my efforts on professors in Holocaust and Genocide Studies departments, which turned out to be a wild goose chase.

Thanks for getting in touch, and I hope you and/or Andrew will be able to join me for the second hour of Saturday's show.

Kevin

Begin forwarded message:

> Dear Roberto Muehlenkamp,
>
> I noticed that you seem well-informed and willing and able to take on the Holocaust revisionists, and was wondering if you could rebut Thomas Dalton on my radio show this coming Saturday, April 24, 11-midnight GMT. My audience includes many people who are skeptical of all official stories, including those that are true, and Dalton's work has had an impact on some of these people. So I decided to invite Dalton for the first hour of my show, and then bring on someone to rebut him for the second hour. If you can't do that, I would be grateful if you would suggest someone who could.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Kevin
> Skype: DrKevinBarrett
> 608-579-1068
>
>
>
> Kevin Barrett
> http://www.truthjihad.com
> Author, Questioning the War on Terror: A Primer for Obama Voters: http://www.questioningthewaronterror.com
>
>
>
>

Kevin Barrett
http://www.truthjihad.com
Author, Questioning the War on Terror: A Primer for Obama Voters: http://www.questioningthewaronterror.com

Kevin had obviously realized that he had tried to contact me via the wrong e-mail addresses. Andrew Mathis had also contacted him about the radio show in the meantime, and Kevin was asking if I could also be available in case Andrew couldn’t make it. I responded as follows on Thu, April 22, 2010 3:49:41 PM (my comments to Kevin’s remarks are bolded so they can be distinguished more easily):

Re: Fwd: radio invitation, re: holocaust revisionism debunking
...
From:
Guadalupe Salcedo [Chat now]
...
View Contact
To: Kevin Barrett
Cc: Andrew Mathis

Hi Kevin,

Please find below my replies to your e-mail after each paragraph.

Roberto
From: Kevin Barrett
To: Guadalupe Salcedo
Cc: Andrew Mathis
Sent: Thu, April 22, 2010 2:04:10 PM
Subject: Fwd: radio invitation, re: holocaust revisionism debunking

Hello Roberto,

Great to hear from you! Below is the message I sent Monday to robert.muehlenkamp@lis1.siemens.pt, webmaster@holocaust-history.org

First e-mail address ceased to exist a long time ago, and I was never an active member of THHP - all they got there from me is a translation, IIRC.

I'm actually a free-speech-fanatic radio host and 9/11 revisionist, not a holocaust revisionist, and certainly not an online-forum debater on that topic!

I'm sure you'll be glad to sign my petition text, then. You find it under http://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2008/02/petition-to-german-legislator.html

Since I posted the blog entry you saw, I got in touch with Andrew Mathis, who will rebut Dalton during the second hour of Saturday's show IF we can get him Dalton's book in time (working on it - the publisher will overnight him the book as soon as they get a snailmail address). Meanwhile, are you also available this Saturday, 11-midnight GMT, in case for some reason Andrew can't do it?

Sure, but how would you contact me in Portugal? I can give you my cell phone number, but calling me there will cost you a fortune. Another possibility would be Skype.

Sorry about the email address mixup. I probably should have invited you earlier, instead of concentrating my efforts on professors in Holocaust and Genocide Studies departments, which turned out to be a wild goose chase.

Better luck next time.

Thanks for getting in touch, and I hope you and/or Andrew will be able to join me for the second hour of Saturday's show.

I'll be on standby.

Kevin

Return message from Kevin, Thu, April 22, 2010 4:03:51 PM:

Re: radio invitation, re: holocaust revisionism debunking
...
From:
Kevin Barrett
...
View Contact
To: Guadalupe Salcedo
Cc: Andrew Mathis
Roberto,

Thanks for this.

I just signed your petition.

If you can provide me with a Skype name, American Freedom Radio will be able to use that to contact you at 11 pm GMT. Perhaps you and Andrew could come on together? (Andrew, we'll need a phone number or Skype handle for you.)

As I just informed Andrew, the Kindle edition of the book is available at http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=node%3D1293747011&field-keywords=debating+holocaust+dalton&x=0&y=0 Dalton says it's supposed to drop to 99 cents through the weekend, but last I looked it's still $1.99, which won't go very far in funding revisionism -- it would barely buy a revisionist a cup of coffee here in Wisconsin ;-)

Kevin

I replied by telling Kevin how he could contact me via Skype and requesting him and Andrew to confirm the current time in, respectively, Wisconsin and Philadelphia, so that their time would be correctly matched with mine tonight. Both confirmed and I sent the following message to Kevin on Thu, April 22, 2010 5:45:14 PM:

Re: radio invitation, re: holocaust revisionism debunking
...
From:
Guadalupe Salcedo [Chat now]
...
View Contact
To: Kevin Barrett
Cc: Andrew Mathis
17 hours your time, when you start interviewing "Dalton", is 23 hours my time. I'll be online at that time waiting for your call. If there should be any changes of plan please let me know asap, because I usually do other things on Saturday night.

Roberto

Kevin’s reply on Thu, April 22, 2010 6:54:36 PM was the following:

Re: radio invitation, re: holocaust revisionism debunking
...
From:
Kevin Barrett
...
View Contact
To: Guadalupe Salcedo
Great! You're confirmed. AFR will Skype you at 18 hours my time, 24 hours your time. I appreciate your willingness to devote a Saturday night to this!

I'll soon be posting a notice about the show at http://www.truthjihadradio.blogspot.com If you want to send a short bio, feel free, otherwise I'll do my best.

Kevin

Andrew had in the meantime also confirmed his availability in principle for the time of the show, so Kevin sent another e-mail informing that he would schedule us both. I had one last question to Kevin, which I sent to him on Thu, April 22, 2010 7:07:38 PM:

Re: radio invitation, re: holocaust revisionism debunking
...
From:
Guadalupe Salcedo [Chat now]
...
View Contact
To: Kevin Barrett
Cc: Andrew Mathis
Why not 17 hours your time, 23 hours my time?

Please excuse me if I'm not understanding something, but am I not supposed to listen to your interview with Mr. "Dalton" and then comment his statements?

Kevin’s clarification on Thu, April 22, 2010 7:29:48 PM settled the matter:

Re: radio invitation, re: holocaust revisionism debunking
...
From:
Kevin Barrett
...
View Contact
To: Guadalupe Salcedo
Cc: Andrew Mathis
Sorry -- you should indeed listen to the first hour, beginning at 23 hours your time, by clicking the "listen live" button at http://www.americanfreedomradio.com

As the second hour guests, you and Andrew will get the call from the network at 24 hours your time. Dalton will be off the line, and you both will be on the line, throughout the second hour.

You will not be going head-to-head with Dalton -- though if everyone agrees, we could schedule that kind of show in the future. For now, I think the differences between the two positions will be more clearly articulated without the kinds of interruptions and back-and-forths that would happen with four people on the line at the same time.

Kevin

As our readers can see, I made no conditions whatsoever as concerns the contents or topics of the show. Drew J's wishful thinking again got the better of him. I’ll be listening to what Dalton has to say starting 11 hours GMT tonight, then receive a Skype call from American Freedom Radio and respond to Kevin’s questions and/or comment on the remarks of Mr. "Dalton", whatever is on Kevin's program. Unlike certain persons I always keep my appointments.

The next bitching fish-wife on the CODOH thread thread Dear Andrea Merkel: How much do Raul Hilberg and I owe you? is "jnovitz", who is obviously identical with the repulsive troll who posted on the RODOH forum under many aliases, last as "little grey rabbit". This deplorable fellow is obviously concurring for some "compulsive liar and paranoid wacko of the year" – award in "Revisionist" cloud-cuckoo-land with the smear he sends my way in his posts of Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:13 am and Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:21 am.

From the post of Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:13 am:

There is a good reason why Roberto Muehlenkamp is not allowed on here. He has been caught using adobe acrobat to manipulate screenshots, rountinely misrepresents quotes from printed books, he has been known to attempt to contact employers of internet revisionists to denounce them and may have been involved in the effort to introduce some faked historical material into the deathcamps.org website.

There are no less than 4 lies in this relatively short paragraph.

Lie # 1: "caught using adobe acrobat to manipulate screenshots". What is true is that jnovitz/little gray rabit insistently accused me of having manipulated screenshots, did so on various RODOH threads (Escape from ARC (merge) with understanding Convergence, Understanding Convergence: Eastern European Jews and History as Instrument: Take III and This little Drew J freak seems to be really pissed about me …, among others) and ended up withdrawing with his tail between his legs (or rather his bunny years) after I conclusively demonstrated the imbecility of his accusation in the posts linked to in my post 12150. His nevertheless continuing to peddle this accusation, moreover on a forum that he well knows I have no access to, is further evidence that jnovitz/lgr is the lowliest of scum and that lying comes to him as naturally as breathing.

The same goes for lie # 2: "routinely misrepresents quotes from printed books". Actually there was but one instance in which jnovitz/lgr accused me of having misrepresented a quote from a book, and that accusation was swiftly and conclusively slapped around his ears (see my RODOH posts 12000, 12069 and 12070), whereupon jnovitz/lgr obviously decided to focus on the "screenshot manipulation" nonsense instead.

Lie # 3: "he has been known to attempt to contact employers of internet revisionists to denounce them" is one of this character's older deliberate distortions of facts. What actually happened was that jnovitz/lgr (then writing as "Lamb Supreme" on RODOH) had claimed to be a person by the name of David Phillips, working with the renowned law firm Herbert Smith. I decided to check that claim and thus wrote the following to said law firm, on Mon, February 26, 2007 6:31:11 PM:

Mr. David Phillips
...
From:
Guadalupe Salcedo [Chat now]
...
View Contact
To: contact@herbertsmith.com
Dear Sirs,

My name is Roberto Muehlenkamp, and I am a German citizen domiciled in Portugal.

I am writing to you in my capacity as a moderator of a historical discussion forum that you may find under http://p102.ezboard.com/brodohforum . I thought it might interest you to know that a rather unpleasant character, a Holocaust denier posting under the alias «Lamb Supreme», among others, has claimed to be one of your attorneys or solicitors, by the name of David Phillips.

As I believe this to be a false claim, I hereby kindly ask you to forward this message to Mr. David Phillips, in case you have an attorney or solicitor by that name, so that he may contact me and clear up this matter. Should there be no David Phillips at Herbert Smith LLP, your communication in this sense will be sufficient clarification.

«Lamb Supreme» first claimed to be Mr. David Phillips at Herbert Smith in his post # 11 under [HTML tag edited out]http://p102.ezboard.com/frodohforumfrm10.showMessageRange?topicID=1573.topic&start=21&stop=39 . He repeated the claim in his post # 73 under http://p102.ezboard.com/Will-our-chief-troll-Lamb-Supreme-/frodohforumfrm25.showMessage?topicID=414.topic .

I thank you very much for your attention and remain,

With my best regards,
Roberto Muehlenkamp

Some time after this message, on Wed, March 7, 2007 11:14:08 AM, I received the following e-mail from the real David Phillips, who obviously appreciated my having pointed out that "Lamb Supreme" was falsely claiming to be him:

Unauthorised blogs
...
From:
"Phillips, David"
...
Add to Contacts
To: cortagravatas@yahoo.com
Dear Mr Muehlenkamp,

My name is David Phillips. I am a solicitor at Herbert Smith solicitors in London.

I have recently been passed your email, concerning claims on your website by a poster named "Lamb Supreme" that he is in fact me.

This is completely untrue. I have no idea who "Lamb Supreme" is, or why he is claiming to be me. I have no idea whatsoever how he has found my name, or why he is now claiming to be me.

I should be grateful if you post a message on your site, explaining that I have contacted you and making the following statement :

"My name is David Phillips, a solicitor with the firm of Herbert Smith in London. It has been brought to my attention that someone under the name of "Lamb Supreme" has been posting messages on this site, falsely claiming to be from me. This is absolutely false. I do not know who "Lamb Supreme" is, nor do I know how he has got hold of my name. These posts are absolutely nothing to do with me. Please ignore any further posts from this person in the future."

I would kindly ask you not to post my email address on the site.

Thank you for bringing this matter to my attention.

David

Both messages were at the time posted on the RODOH, on a thread I'll try to find when I have time (the links in my former mail were broken when that thread was moved by a moderator).

So much for my "attempt to contact employers of internet revisionists to denounce them".

Lie # 4: "may have been involved in the effort to introduce some faked historical material into the deathcamps.org website", relates to another of jnovitz/lgr’s idiotic insinuations, expressed in his RODOH post 2820.

The reply to this nonsense in my post 12038 was short and simple:

While lgr goes looking for a new shrink - the current one seems to have failed - , readers are again invited to read the story of the Escape from Sobibor DVD shot passed off as an authentic photograph in this blog:

On the demise of deathcamps.org: how fakes and arrogance killed a great undertaking

In the blog I linked to, as our regular readers will remember, my fellow blogger Sergey Romanov had exposed the carelessness of Mr. Chris Webb, webmaster of the site http://www.holocaustresearchproject.org/, that had led this gentleman to fall for a still from the movie "Escape from Sobibor" passed off as a contemporary photo of the Treblinka "tube" by a certain "Andy Schmidt".

The lame comment of jnovitz/lgr ("Well, whoever it was, it was very naughty."), followed by his aforementioned "distortion" accusation or a repetition thereof, can be read in the fellow’s post 2822. The subsequent comment by the poster KentFord9 in his post 3686 shows that Im not the only RODOH poster familiar with jnovitz/lgr's tricks:

This individual reader judges that the bunny remains the lying bunny he has always been, his attempted smear job stopped as dead in its tracks as his 12 man squad in Lithuania. Nice job, Roberto, exposing the charlatan once again.

Having thus shown how jnovitz/little gray rabbit managed to pack four filthy lies into one relatively short paragraph, I turn to the fellow's subsequent paranoid and also somewhat-less-than-honest accusations in his aforementioned two CODOH posts:

Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:13 am:

He, or more likely associates of him, are also suspects for deathcamps.org and H.E.A.R.T being infected with malicious spyware that has them blocked by google at the moment, doubtless a huge and undeserved embarrassment to the legitimate and ethical owners of those domains
Currently if you go to either those sites you are likely to get a "blocked page"

Reported Attack Page!
This web page at www.deathcamps.org has been reported as an attack page and has been blocked based on your security preferences.
Attack pages try to install programs that steal private information, use your computer to attack others, or damage your system.

Some attack pages intentionally distribute harmful software, but many are compromised without the knowledge or permission of their owners.

Given Roberto Muehlenkamp and friends have engaged in a prolonged campaign of internet vilification against these two sites and their owners, to me they seem likely suspects.

In otherwords, by all means wind up Roberto Muehlenkamp, it is a harmless and entertaining sport, but it is pointless to debate someone so dishonest and with so little intellectual integrity. And I think it is a good idea not to do it here.

I should add, my suggestion that Roberto Muehlenkamp has some association with the breaching of the security of the two domains deathcamps.org and holocaustreseachproject.org is only suspicion, based nothing more than past observation of his unscrupulous nature.

Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:21 am:

BUT, I should add also, I visit both sites quite regularly and the first I came aware of it was after Roberto Muehlenkamp mentioned it on the internet saying this
"
Mr. L should contact Google about the site he brags so much about, by the way. I get warning messages when trying to access that site today, like the following:"
ie almost as soon as the infection occurred, Roberto was aware of it. Even more suspiciously it occurred very soon ( a few days) someone with very vague association to H.E.A.R.T published an internet rankings comparison showing that H.E.A.R.T massively outranked Holocaust Controversies blog.

The infection happened literally a few days later. You draw your own conclusions.

Actually I wouldn’t put it past H.E.A.R.T.'s Carmelo Lisciotto to have created said infection himself as a means of smearing his perceived opponents, considering his history of fake smear blogs and other dishonest behavior documented in Sergey Romanov’s series H.E.A.R.T. (holocaustresearchproject.org) exposed, especially the blogs H.E.A.R.T. defenders and their methods and H.E.A.R.T. defenders and their methods (cont.). Links to further examples of this behavior have been posted today by Lisciotto's alter ego "Herodotus2010.rodoh" in his RODOH posts 74 and 75. Thanks for helping me make my point, Mr. Lisciotto!

As to what jnovitz/lgr calls a "prolonged campaign of internet vilification against these two sites and their owners", I repeat what I told Lisciotto, in response to one of the boringly repetitive smear posts he has lately filled the RODOH forum's "Siberian Exile" section with, in my post 12122:

The poor fellow keeps repeating the "vehemently hate www.holocaustresearchproject.org" and "conspiratorial concerted effort" nonsense, thereby confiming my characterization of him as a paranoid monomaniac.

Actually the articles collected here were the work of Sergey Romanov alone, and as anyone reading them will recognize they were related to the less-than-commendable behavior of H.E.A.R.T.'s founding fathers. A period of two and a half years between the series of articles starting on 30.10.2006 and ending on 14.04.2007 on the one hand and the article of 20.11.2009 on the other furthermore suggests that H.E.A.R.T. isn't exactly one of the author's priorities. Get a life, Mr. L.

The RODOH thread in which I wrote the above also contains my posts 12126 and 12127, in which I called Lisciotto's attention to the problems that the http://www.holocaustresearchproject.org/ and http://www.deathcamps.org// sites were having. Regarding the latter I asked Lisciotto to try and fix those problems quickly:

As ARC is still a good site (thanks to great researcher Webb's exceptionally wise decision to freeze it after he had appropriated it instead of ruining it with "Andy Schmidt" fakes), that is really a shame.

I would therefore appreciate if you could contact Google and fix the problem asap, Mr. L. Thanks in advance!

No irony there, as I sometimes link to http://www.deathcamps.org// now that http://www.death-camps.org/ (the mirror site that used to be maintained by other former members of the ARC research group after Webb appropriated the original site) is no longer online. I last did so in my blog Belzec Mass Graves and Archaeology - Continuation (2), IIRC. Maybe jnovitz/lgr can explain why I should have tried to damage a site that I use as a source, if I had the manipulative inclinations he is obviously projecting onto me plus the computer skills required to bring about such infection. Actually my abilities in this respect do not go beyond using standard programs from a user perspective. I don't know if any of my "associates" (jnovitz/lgr must be referring to my fellow HC bloggers) has such skills, but my ability to judge a person’s character would be a very bad one if any of them descended to the level of Lisciotto-style manipulations.

Differences in ideology aside (jnovitz/lgr is a Holocaust denier of a particularly lunatic variety that even denies the existence of crematoria at Auschwitz-Birkenau and other camps, whereas Lisciotto is what Sergey has called a Holocaust fanatic), the two loonies get along as well as becomes birds of a feather, by the way. At least this is suggested by lgr’s amusing doublethink/doublespeak exercise in his post 2859, where he precedes another repetition of his manipulation insinuations discussed above with the following cynical remark:

Mr Herodotus, I found your Alexa rankings extremely informative. Would you be able to pass on my congratulations to the HEART team from me? I see them as adversaries, but I can always appreciate an opponent that fights fair.

Like the equally narcissistic Lisciotto, jnovitz/lgr obviously projecting his own pathological concerns onto me when assuming that I would be worried about or angered by H.E.A.R.T. having far more visitors than HC. Needless to say, his babbling about my "little intellectual integrity" and "unscrupulous nature" is another exercise of self-projection.

The next bitching fish-wife on the CODOH thread Dear Andrea Merkel: How much do Raul Hilberg and I owe you?, who calls himself "Karl Radl", will be dealt with in my next blog.

More smear & bitching on CODOH (Part 2)

Update on the mentally unbalanced HSRDB freak ...

2010-04-18T07:59:00.001-07:00

I'm glad to see that I still figure prominently in the poor creature's nightmares, judging by the latest update of his smear site [screenshot 1] [screenshot 2] (screenshots of an earlier version see here).

And he's stupid enough to out himself as the author of this smear site, as this screenshot shows.

Update, 20.04.2010 17:51 GMT: The freak sent mail.

The account reactivation issue ...

2010-03-12T04:10:00.001-08:00

... has been settled the way of Jonnie "Hannover" Hargis, by converting an expired temporary ban into a permanent ban. See my RODOH post 11987, which also features another of Hargis' mendacious "Muehlenkamp got demolished" victory dances and the following manifestation of gratitude by Drew J:

Always ready with the old topic references. I love it. I have only read about the coke and the hosing of the chambers. Now I have more to read. Thanks Hannover. Always there for us.

"Always there for us". Touching, isn't it?

The mentally unbalanced HSRDB freak ...

2010-03-11T03:09:00.001-08:00

... is obviously trying to smear me by posting crap on a website he created with my name [ screenshot page 1, screenshot page 2]. He is offering this "top website" ("over 2,300 hits recorded in 21 days") for sale to the highest bidder on E-Bay, or so he proclaims. Oh, the imbecility.

Not that I'm worried about this, on the contrary. Such criminal activities are further proof that "Revisionism" appeals to rather sick minds, and thus another shot in the foot of "Revisionism".

Meanwhile, on the "CODOH Revisionist Forum" ...

2010-03-07T03:23:00.001-08:00

... my old friend Drew J (who obviously knows that my CODOH account has not yet been reactivated, for he refers to the previous blog and thereby signals that he's interested in what we write here) is again mouthing off about me, thereby displaying a miserable personality and (as he claims to have bested me here and there) his delusions of adequacy.

In his post of Fri Mar 05, 2010 3:09 am, Drew J spins silly
conjectures about Goebbels' diaries not being authentic. The only "indication" he can offer is that in a certain diary entry I mentioned (which was brought to my attention by Drew J's fellow believer "Thomas Dalton" via a lower-ranking rambler who calls himself Ralph Gordon, see my RODOH post 11943) Goebbels shows no compunction to write about death and executions, as I pointed out. For Drew J this suggests that Goebbels' diaries are not authentic. Why Goebbels should not have called things by their proper names in his own private diary entry - a document not meant for public disclosure - Drew J doesn't explain, instead turning to imbecilic "Robert knows deep down inside but will never admit it" - accusations and babbling that "There seems to be no good reason to think those are authentic Goebbels diaries.". That the diary entries fit the historical context in which they were written in a manner suggesting contemporary insider knowledge (for instance, the diary entry of 27.03.1942 was written ten days after the start of deportations from Lublin to Belzec extermination camp and mentions the head of Aktion Reinhard(t), Odilo Globocnik, as "the former Gauleiter of Vienna"), that they were never used for propaganda purposes (one doesn't make forgeries to keep them in the drawer) but gradually became known as historians analyzed them and realized their significance, that neither historians nor criminal justice authorities referring to these diary entries (the entry of 27 March 1942 is mentioned, for instance, in the judgment at the Sobibor trial in Hagen in 1966) have found any reason to doubt the authenticity of these diaries (that includes erstwhile "Revisionist" favorite David Irving, who pointed out that he had personally been in Moscow and examined the originals of the diaries), plus his own inability to point out indications of forgery (Goebbels' having written about deaths and executions is none) - all this is no "good reason" for Drew J to "think those are authentic Goebbels diaries". His lack of arguments makes his forgery claims look increasingly desperate.

What is especially funny is that, while on the one hand "Revisionists" like "Dalton" and Gordon are pathetically trying to explain away the incriminating content of Goebbels' diaries, including but not limited to the one of 27 March 1942, other followers of the "Revisionist" creed such as Drew J are yelling "forgery" and thereby confirming that they consider Goebbels diary entries to have incriminating contents incompatible with their articles of faith. For if they didn't consider these diary entries to have incriminating contents, why would they be claiming that they are not authentic? A discussion between the two schools of "Revisionist" nonsense ("Dalton"/Gordon vs. Drew J/Heink) should be most amusing to watch.

The one good thing about Drew J is that he still seems to disagree with the cowardly disfigurement of links to the RODOH forum, which like other CODOH practices speaks volumes about the hypocrisy of their claim to "open debate". Drew J wrote:

Sorry but I have not reproduced hyperlinks here as codoh will not allow rodoh links to go unsubstituted with the old 'aliceinwonderland' thing.

I wonder long will it take for Drew J to also swallow this "thing" and fully tow the party line.

Drew J's obsession with this writer furthermore shows in his post of Fri Mar 05, 2010 3:09 am, where he writes the following:

Let's talk about how Hoess was tortured and how other nazis were tortured to say things to fit the propaganda. I went over this many times with Roberto Muehlenkamp, but he refuses to acknowledge reality. He eventually budged but said Hoess wasn't tortured. Just MISHANDLED. Can you believe that?

Drew J's claim that he "went over this" with me is funny insofar as the discussion took place on two different forums (me writing on the RODOH forum, where Drew J wouldn't show up, he writing on the CODOH forum where I was not allowed to write). The "budged" crap shows Drew J's eagerness to convince himself that he gained the upper hand (he must be so desperate to have an experience of success that he claims them in the absence of any). As to the "tortured" vs. "mishandled" thing, I'd call that a false dilemma as it doesn't matter which of the two terms one uses for the treatment that Hoess received at the hand of his British captors, which Hoess himself described as follows in the memoirs he later wrote in Polish captivity (from the translation by Constantine FitzGibbon published by Phoenix Press under the title "Commandant of Auschwitz", pages 173f.):

I was arrested on 11 March, 1946.
My phial of poison had been broken two days before.
When I was aroused from sleep, I thought at first I was being attacked by robbers, for many robberies were taking place at that time. That was how they managed to arrest me. I was maltreated by the Field Security Police.
I was taken to Heide where I was put in those very barracks from which I had been released by the British eight months earlier.
At my first interrogation, evidence was obtained by beating me. I do not know what is in the record, although I signed it. Alcohol and the whip were too much for me. The whip was my own, which by chance had got into my wife’s luggage. It had hardly ever touched my horse, far less the prisoners. Nevertheless, one of my interrogators was convinced that I had perpetually used it for flogging the prisoners.
After some days I was taken to Minden-on-the-Weser, the main interrogation center in the British Zone. There I received further rough treatment at the hands of the English public prosecutor, a major.

What matters, as I remember having pointed out to Drew J as we "went over this", was that Hoess stated nothing under the influence of this mishandling or torture (whichever term is Drew J's preference) that he didn't state, even in more detail, on later occasions when he was far removed from the influence of physical violence, namely in his testimony for the defence of Kaltenbrunner before the IMT and in his writings in Polish captivity, including his notes under the title The Final Solution of the Jewish Question in Auschwitz. In the latter he even told his captors where they could stick their 4 million figure for the death toll of Auschwitz-Birkenau. From the translation in "Commandant of Auschwitz", pages 193 and following (emphasis added):

I myself never knew the total number and I have nothing to help me make an estimate of it.
I can only remember the figure involved in the larger actions, which were repeated to me by Eichmann or his deputies.
From Upper Silesia and Polish territory under German rule … 250,000
Germany and Theresienstadt … 100,000
Holland … 95,000
Belgium … 20,000
France … 110,000
Greece … 65,000
Hungary … 400,000
Slovakia … 90,000
I can no longer remember the figures for the smaller actions, but they were insignificant in comparison with the numbers given above.
I regard a total of two and a half millions [stated by Hoess earlier interrogations including his IMT deposition - RM] as far too high. Even Auschwitz had limits to its destructive possibilities.
Figures given by former prisoners are figments of the imagination and lack any foundation.

Those Poles must have been squeezing Hoess's balls like hell for him to write this.

The figures given by Hoess add up to 1,130,000.

The figure estimated by the Soviet investigation in 1945, on the basis of the theoretical capacity of the installations and the depositions of former captives, was 4,000,000. This figure was officially upheld by the Polish government until 1992.

What Hoess was doing here was to directly challenge the reliability of his captors’ other sources, of their and the Soviet investigation commissions and of the eyewitnesses on which these commissions had relied. The latter he attacked in the strongest terms, calling them "figments of the imagination".

Why would the Poles let Hoess get away with this, if they had been bent on dictating his statements?

Why, if "Revisionists" were to be believed, would they even have coerced him into producing these highly inconvenient, counterproductive statements?

Were they so boundlessly dumb as to induce Hoess into shooting them in the foot, into openly writing into his memoirs that their own estimates of the death toll of his camp were wildly exaggerated?

Or is the "Revisionist" contention that what Hoess wrote was dictated or "doctored" by his captors what Hoess himself would have called "figments of the imagination" lacking any foundation?

I'll leave my friend Drew J to wonder about this (once more). Let's see if he can come up with something better than simply ignoring these and other inconvenient statements of Hoess that render absurd the claim that everything the man said or wrote was extracted from him by torture, or lamely claiming that the above-quoted writings of Hoess are not authentic.

As you will be reading this, Drew J, can I ask you for a favor? Please remind the CODOH moderator of reactivating my account, so that we can continue our conversation on the CODOH forum. Thanks in advance!

Update, 10.03.2010:

See my RODOH posts nos 11981, 11982 and 11983.

Showpieces of "Revisionist" stupidity/mendacity ...

2010-02-26T02:41:00.001-08:00

... are being discussed in the RODOH forum's thread Was Goebbels out of the Extermination loop?, where "Thomas Dalton" is being quoted by his fellow "Revisionist" Ralph Gordon. See my posts nos. 11943, 11945 and 11949.

Hi there, Mr. CODOH Forum Moderator

2010-02-20T13:39:00.001-08:00

Could you please reactivate my account?

Ban period is over.

Update, 21.02.2010 13:51 hours GMT: Still waiting for reactivation.

Update, 22.02.2010 08:20 hours GMT: Still waiting for reactivation.

Update, 22.02.2010 23:17 hours GMT: Still waiting for reactivation. What's the matter?

Update, 23.02.2010 23:53 hours GMT: Still waiting for reactivation. Are they afraid of me?

Update, 27.02.2010 12:46 hours GMT: Still waiting for reactivation. It seems they are afraid of me indeed.

Update, 07.03.2010 11:22 hours GMT: Still waiting for reactivation. Meanwhile, on the "CODOH Revisionist forum ...

Mr. Gerdes drives another nail into the "Revisionist" coffin

2010-02-20T06:38:00.001-08:00

On the "CODOH Revisionist Forum" (where my account has not yet been reactivated even though the one-month period of the ban decreed on 19.01.2010 has already expired; I have sent an e-mail to the moderator requesting reactivation), my old friend Greg Gerdes accomplished something extraordinary for his low intellect and character.

After again repeating his simian "locate/prove the existence of just one mass grave containing 1/xth of y% of the alleged mass murder at z extermination camp" - hollering (see here and here), and having apparently realized that his fellow true believers didn't give a fuck anymore about this nonsense (last commented by me here), he opened a thread called jews, Transit Camps and the Soviet Gulag. On this thread, after briefly repeating his mendacious "not so much as one single grave [snip blah, blah, blah]" - mantra, he tried to provide evidence (yes, believe it or not: Gerdes tried to provide evidence!) that the Jews deported to "the fraudulently alleged 'pure extermination centers'", which "were in fact transit camps" (i.e. the at least about 1,517,500 Jews deported to Chelmno, Belzec, Sobibor and Treblinka, thereof ca. 152,000 to Chelmno, 434,500 to Belzec, 150,000 to Sobibor and 781,000 to Treblinka, see my RODOH post # 11878) ended up in the Soviet Gulag and perished there.

Considering Greg Gerdes'private standards of evidence as concerns Nazi crimes, which obviously require not only physically locating and establishing the dimensions of the mass graves and the quality of their contents (that has been done by archaeological investigation regarding all aforementioned camps except Treblinka, where Polish criminal investigators found a large area covered by human remains and established the depth of at least one mass grave, but did not determine the precise location and dimensions of each grave - see my RODOH post # 11879), but also physically locating and quantifying the human remains contained in each grave, one would expect the evidence for Gerdes' "The real jewish holocaust - by Soviet Gulag" - case to consist wholly or mainly of physical evidence to the burial of enormous numbers of Jewish bodies at the site of former Gulag camp complexes like Kolyma and Vorkuta.

What we get instead is this:

I would like to present, as exhibit # 1 for this thread - Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn's book - The Gulag Archipelago. If you haven't read this book yet, you don't know the holohoax. It will give you answers for things that you didn't even know there were questions about.

And for exhibit # 2, I give you:

Surviving the Camps but Struggling in Brooklyn

New York Times, January 21, 2010

By JENNIFER MASCIA

Ruth Usherenko keeps an improbably thick book on a table beside the couch in her living room. In it are roughly 58,000 names, all belonging to Jewish Berliners who perished during Hitler's regime. "All my girlfriends, all my relatives, all my neighbors are in here,"

...Beside her sat her sister, Toni Usherenko, 85, equally diminutive and delicate, who spoke in the same halting hybrid of Russian and English. The two live a block apart in Brighton Beach, Brooklyn, maintaining a closeness forged during World War II and later in a Siberian prison camp...

The sisters spent their early years in Neustrelitz, a town in northern Germany. After their father, a tailor, became a target of Nazi intimidation, the family moved to Berlin...

The girls' father was badly beaten in the riot, suffering a heart attack and a damaged kidney. Three years later, he was taken to Sachsenhausen concentration camp, where he perished.

Weeks after their father was apprehended, Ruth, Toni and their mother were taken to Gross-Rosen , a work camp...

In 1945, the three women were sent by the Soviets to a labor camp in Siberia; they were considered suspect because of their religion and their German provenance.

"We couldn't speak one word of Russian," Ruth Usherenko recalled. "They didn't feed us. When people died, they didn't bury them — they put them in the forest and the wolves were eating them."

So complete was their isolation that they did not know when the war ended. "Stalin passed away in 1953, and they released us in 1955," Ruth Usherenko recalled. "A woman came to us and said, `The war is over.' "

The three women settled in the Ukrainian town of Dnepropetrovsk, where they worked as milliners. The sisters married — Ruth to a shoemaker and Toni to an aviation engineer — and in 1981, after years of trying to leave the Soviet Union, the families were able to emigrate to Brooklyn...

But having money for heat is most important to Ms. Usherenko, perhaps because the cold is a reminder of the frigid decade she spent in Siberia. "They put us in a cold school, no steam," she recounted. "We had one blanket for me, my mother and my sister. Everybody died."

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/21/nyreg ... mps&st=cse

Having read Solshenizyn's The Gulag Archipelago myself, I don't remember having found much there about Jewish victims of Stalinist violence. One or the other individual whose name is mentioned in the book may be Jewish, the purge against Jewish doctors, artists and intellectuals of the late Stalin era is addressed, and that's it, IIRC. But let's give Gerdes the benefit of doubt and assume that he presented Solshenizyn's book only as evidence of the existence and operation of the Soviet Gulag camps. For this purpose I can accept his "exhibit 1", even though Gerdes nowhere explains why memoirs of a not exactly impartial Soviet dissident should be better proof of the Gulag than the research and investigation results of historians and mostly German criminal investigators, who discovered, cross-checked and evaluated a large body of eyewitness, documentary and physical evidence, including but not limited to what is quoted or referred to in my aforementioned RODOH posts, is proof of the mass murder at the Nazi extermination camps. I assume that proof of the death of over 1.5 million Jewish deportees in the Soviet Gulag, the existence of which Gerdes considers proven by his "exhibit # 1", is supposed to be contained in "exhibit # 2".

"Exhibit # 2" is an article in the New York Times about two elderly Jewish sisters living in Brooklyn, Ruth and Toni Usherenko, who during World War II were deported by the Nazis to Gross-Rosen concentration camp in Poland. When Soviet troops overran this camp in 1945, the two ladies and their mother were "considered suspect because of their religion and their German provenance", and eventually sent to a labor camp in Siberia, from where they were only released in 1955, two years after Stalin's death. Then they lived in the Soviet Union until 1981 before emigrating to the United States.

I'd say that presenting this as evidence that the Jews deported to Chelmno, Belzec, Sobibor and Treblinka "transit camps" (for whose transportation to the Nazi-occupied Soviet territories or to labor camps in Poland there is not a shred of evidence in the first place, even though there would be a huge paper trail and thousands upon thousands of eyewitnesses if either or both had occurred) is further evidence, arguably some of the best evidence yet, that Greg Gerdes has as much brain matter as is suggested by his aspect. For apart from displaying his flagrant double standards in the dumbest manner, and from idiotically insinuating that one can derive conclusions about the fate of at least over 1.5 million people from the story of just two individuals, he apparently didn't notice that neither of the two old ladies was deported to any of the extermination camps Chelmno, Belzec, Sobibor and Treblinka. Neither were they deported to any of the dual purpose camps Auschwitz-Birkenau and Majdanek, which served both as concentration camps and as extermination camps. No, they were deported to Gross Rosen, a plain concentration camp. Many of the inmates of that camp were not Jewish, and of the about 120,000 prisoners who passed through the Gross-Rosen camp system, "only" 40,000 died either in Gross-Rosen or during the evacuation of the camp. That was where the two key witnesses for Gerdes'case (it's also extraordinary that Gerdes all of a sudden accepts as evidence the testimony of eyewitnesses, moreover Jewish ones) spent the war. The never even got close to the places of mass murder that Gerdes calls "transit camps".

While I'm not surprised that someone as limited as Gerdes makes a fool of himself in such a pitiable manner, the hilariously silly claim that Gerdes "drives another nail into the Holocoffin" with his "evidence" was made not by Gerdes, but by a slightly more intelligent - though no less obnoxious - "Revisionist" from New Zealand, who posts on the RODOH forum as "little gray rabbit" (the alias he finally stuck with after having used at least half a dozen others). This gentleman posted Gerdes' above-quoted "exhibit # 2" in his RODOH thread Mr Gerdes drives another nail into the Holocoffin, followed by the cryptic remark "Any comment by me is superfluous". After his silliness was pointed out by Jonathan Harrison and Wahrheitseeker, and after his brother-in-spirit ralphgordon asked him what point he was trying to make, lgr tuned down his rhetoric and argued that this "exhibit" cast doubt on the accuracy of records of people murdered by the Nazis, in which he "expected" the sisters Ruth and Toni Usherenko to have at some time been or still be included:

Gerdes put it over at CODOH, its from the New York Times. The point is not particularly difficult, 3 alleged Holocaust victims were taken off to Siberia and then not allowed to leave Russia for 40 more years. I expect at some point they would have been included on a list of murdered by the Nazis - and perhaps they still are, as the article does not give their unmarried names.

Unfortunately for lgr, the Usherenko sisters had been residing in Germany before their deportation, and Germany is one of the countries that have a more or less complete record of the names and other personal data and of the individual fates of Jews living on their pre-war territory who fell victim to Nazi persecution and mass murder. Since 2007, an internet edition of the "Gedenkbuch – Opfer der Verfolgung der Juden unter der nationalsozialistischen Gewaltherrschaft in Deutschland 1933 – 1945" (Memorial Book - Victims of Persecution of the Jews under the National Socialist Rule of Violence in Germany 1933 - 1945) is available on the website of the German Federal Archives in Koblenz. This online database, which includes 159,972 names of Jews who had resided in Germany within its borders as of 31 December 1937, thereof about 155,000 murdered persons, made it possible to check whether lgr's insinuation was pertinent or just "Revisionist" wishful thinking. If Ruth and Toni Usherenko were mentioned in the Federal Archives' database as having fallen victim to Nazi persecution and mass murder, this would mean that said database cannot be necessarily relied upon and information from there should be cross-checked against other sources before using it. If, on the other hand, the two sisters' names were absent from the database, this would mean that they were not wrongly recorded as victims of Nazi persecution and mass murder, and thus speak for the reliability of the database.

The searches done by Dr. Neander and me (see Dr. Neander's posts nos. 562, 563, 564 and 565 and my post # 11919) revealed that Ruth and Toni Usherenko are nowhere mentioned in the Federal Archives'database. On the other hand, we managed to find the man who in all probability was the ladies' father, Nachim Usherenko. As Dr. Neander pointed out, N. Usherenko was a tailor in Berlin (just like the two sisters' father), who lived in the city between 1936 and 1941; he was the only man by that name recorded in the Berlin address book. The sisters' father was a tailor who moved to Berlin some time after the Nazis came to power, according to the NYT article. Nachim Usherenko was deported to Sachsenhausen and perished there, just like the sisters' father. The chances that Nachim Usherenko was not the father of Ruth and Toni Usherenko are thus rather remote.

So thanks to Gerdes' and lgr's attempt to drive "another nail into the Holocoffin", Dr. Neander and I found out that Nachim Usherenko succumbed to Nazi violence and is accordingly recorded in the Federal Archives' database, that his daughters Ruth and Toni survived Nazi violence and are not recorded in this database of Jews from Germany murdered by the Nazis, and that it can therefore be assumed that the Federal Archives did a proper job and recorded as Jews from Germany murdered by the Nazis only Jews from Germany actually murdered by the Nazis. Another puerile attempt to vindicate "Revisionist" nonsense was another glorious shot in the "Revisionist" foot - or, to paraphrase lgr's expression, another nail in the "Revisionist" coffin.

The Federal Archives' database (click the icon "Namensverzeichnis" at bottom of page, which leads to this mask, check the field "Deportationsort", insert the name of the camp after "Suchen nach" and click the icon "Suche starten" at the bottom of the mask) contains, among others, the names of Jews from Germany deported to Chelmno (2,570 names), Belzec (290 names), Sobibor (5,689 names; regarding some deportees it is uncertain whether the final destination was Sobibor or Majdanek) and Treblinka (7,800 names). If Mr. Gerdes can prove that any of these people ended up in the Soviet Gulag, I'll send him a big box of bananas.

PS, 23.02.2010, 11:05 hours GMT:

Mr. Gerdes seems to have worn out his welcome on CODOH indeed, or then at least one of his fellow "Revisionists" has grown understandably tired of Gerdes' repetitive remixes of the same stupid song. On his thread New NAFH challenge/reward offer, Gerdes' imbecilic rhetorical question:

Would you say that the hoaxers utter silence proves that there are no human remains in fraudulently alleged Sobibor "huge mass grave" #7/45?

received the following reply from "Lamprecht" (which of course caused Gerdes to freak out and give Lamprecht the "show me just one this and that" - treatment):

Their utter silence proves that they don't care about what you have to say, and pretending that they're ignoring you for the sole reason that they can't answer your questions is dishonest and sophomoric.

Apart from the "sole" thing ("hoaxers" can answer all of Gerdes' questions to the extent they are pertinent and relevant and not just hollow rhetorical bluster, which however applies to only a minority of said questions at best, and this particular "hoaxer" has answered Gerdian questions many times before whereas Gerdes left hundreds of my questions unanwered), Lamprecht is right. We don't care about Gerdes' hysterical, moronic hollering. However, this writer likes to occasionally use Gerdes' tirades as an opportunity to a) present evidence inconvenient to "Revisionist" articles of faith, most of which Gerdes prefers to ignore, and b) use Gerdes as a splendid demonstration object of "Revisionist" ... well, ill-reasoning, to put it politely. And I intend to do so on the "CODOH Revisionist Forum", to the extent that the moderator should permit it. I hope my account has been activated since yesterday evening.

HSRDB.com libels Roberto and me

2010-02-20T02:03:00.001-08:00

As of now we can see this disclaimer on that site [screenshot]:

On the 18th February, this site was suspended due to threats by Holocaust fanatics.

This site will be re-launched on 22nd February 2010 and will no longer be hosting databases associated with the Holocaust or World War Two until further notice. We are currently accepting requests for databases related to significant historical events that occurred during World War One.

Have a suggestion?

We would like to take the opportunity to thank all contributors to the project to date.

Why did this happen?

Two Holocaust fanatics, Mr. Roberto Muehlenkamp and Mr.Sergy Romanov have apparently been attempting to derail this project by fraudulently claiming that it is a Holocaust denial website.

They have never been associated with, nor contributed to this project. They have based their criticisms on the contributions of others and ignored the stated goals of this project. Sensitive information and photographs were obtained by hacking a private Gmail account belonging to a web-designer who was attempting to generate interest I the project. This information was subsequently used to threaten our contributors and my family personally.

It is a shame that certain elements within society resort to such tactics to achieve their ends, destroying the good work of other in the process.

As a side note, it's interesting how these claims mirror the claims of another mentally unbalanced person - Carmelo Lisciotto (of holocaustresearchproject.org) - who through a series of fake blogs tries to spread rumors that me and Nick hacked deathcamps.org because apparently we're closet Holocaust deniers (for the real story behind deathcamps.org demise click here). All these internet loons have poor fantasy and a single old playbook, just changing the sign as necessary (Holocaust deniers/Holocaust fanatics).

Anyway, no, nobody of us had any relation to the alleged hacking of any email, and we doubt that any email was hacked in the first place (this is a mere unfounded claim by a person who lies as he breathes). But yes, information about the person behind that site was obtained after he legally threatened the members of RODOH and RODOH itself for something he didn't like (i.e. people calling him an antisemite). We don't like frivolous legal threats coming from semi-anonymous a-holes, so we decided to take a look at what Google had in store. Tracking down the owner's information was ridiculously easy since he was very stupid by sharing it with everybody.

1. His Facebook page had publicly accessible photos of him and his family, though under an assumed surname (which he had used at RODOH and elsewhere).

2. He tested the first version of HRSDB on the site he created for his son (what kind of person does that?). Although he deleted it, the Google cache still shows numerous traces even as I write this text (Google cache is temporary, but it lasts for some time; in any case we've taken screenshots).

3. The public domain name registration records of various sites confirmed his identity.

So after numerous legal threats issued by this person right and left, and after he created a libelous website about Roberto with the threat of exposing "everything" about Roberto and his private life ("You see, as you are obviously such a special person, the world really should know EVERYTHING there is to know about you, your views and your personal life. I intend to go DEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEP buddy. Real deep."), I suggested to him that I might also expose this collected information, especially to the local police of the city he now resides in the country where Holocaust denial and antisemitic propaganda are illegal.

That was the extent of the "threats" mentioned in the disclaimer. So Richard is just being hypocritical.

As to the claims about that website being fraudulent, see this article by Jonathan and decide for yourself.

Another mind that "Revisionism" attracts

2010-02-19T03:48:00.001-08:00

The self-projecting sociopath who hopes to work wonders for "Revisionism" with the database he is putting together under http://www.hsrdb.com ("Just wait until this new database that cross-references ALL the witness testimonies about these topics in one report goes online - the gross inconsistencies will be exposed once and for all."; screenshot) has reacted to my previous blog in a manner that is hardly surprising.

First he freaked out, as becomes his pathological state of mind.

Then, after expanding the website he created for bitching about me (screenshot of what it looked like yesterday at 14:19 hours GMT, prior to said expansion), he decided to put it up "for sale" (screenshot taken on 19.02.2009 at 11:40 hours GMT), giving the address "me@RobertoMuehlenkamp.com" for "direct inquiries".

This madman, who like others of his kind is attracted to "Revisionist" madness, has been active on the web under two names, Richard L. and Richard A. The former is the name under which he registered the website http://www.hsrdb.com. The latter is a "dummy name" used "by our contributors to enter forums", according to a message on the RODOH forum in which our friend, besides spouting other confused nonsense, accuses me or my "associate" of having hacked his e-mail account and "accessed personal and sensitive emails" (I don't know who my "associate" could be, and I couldn't hack anything even if were to try, because my computer skills don't go beyond handling a PC from a user's perspective). Both names are probably pseudonyms, so I'll simply call the fellow by the name "Richard", under which he posted on this blogspot. Richard apparently lives in Prague, as Sergey found out along with other information.

Richard's fits of hysteria concerning me started when I posted this message on the RODOH forum:

Your posts are way too long for their meager content, Mr. Just The Truth * (Posters are not to refer to fellow posters as by anything but their real names unless given permission to do otherwise. NKVD) .

Try providing some evidence that would support your "transit camp" claim. If hundreds of thousands of people had been transported from Treblinka "transit camp" to the "Russian East", you would have a huge paper trail and thousands upon thousands of eyewitnesses to choose from.

In the original version of this message, edited by the moderator, I had addressed Richard not by his forum handle "JustTheTruth", but by a misspelled version of what I thought was his surname, which I remembered having seen somewhere on the RODOH board (I haven't found the respective post since; it may have been deleted to accommodate Richard's proclaimed anonymity concerns). As Richard informed the board in his above-mentioned later message, that name is a "dummy name". So what made him freak out was probably not his privacy paranoia but my reference to an unsolvable "Revisionist" dilemma (the absence of any evidence suggesting deportation from Treblinka extermination camp to the Nazi-occupied Soviet territories, even though such evidence should be plentiful if such deportations had taken place) plus my criticism of his posts being "too long for their meager content" (the latter may have been predominant in triggering his rage, considering that sociopaths tend to have a "grandiose sense of self" and be "outraged by insignificant matters"). This adds a touch of characteristic mendacity to the fellow's furious yelling in several posts of equal content on the RODOH forum (here, here, here and here). I responded to this yelling in my posts nos. 11907 and 11908.

Meanwhile, Richard had also found my e-mail address, presumably in my blog profile, and started sending silly threats and accusations and other hysterical nonsense my way. These e-mail messages, as announced in my previous blog (the bitching website is still in place, even though its content is currently not visible, and Richard is using an e-mail address with my name in it) shall be transcribed hereafter, also in order to complete Richard's pathology profile as currently known, and for the amusement value of some of his utterances (his "success story" bragging I find especially funny, and his having "sat up for three hours deciding how to respond" to my "terrorism" made me laugh out loud). I also transcribe my replies to these mails. Any further comments are unnecessary, as our friend brilliantly condemns himself through his own words. I have made Richard's gmail-surname unrecognizable, even though it is a dummy according to Richard, lest any decent citizen bearing the same surname be associated with this individual.

You gutless sociopath!
...
Tue, February 16, 2010 11:08:39 AM
From:
Richard Axxxx
...
View Contact
To: cortagravatas@yahoo.com

Roberto, I really appreciate your "exposing" me on the RODOH forum and
publishing my name in an attempt to intimidate me, you cowardly fuck. I
think you might realize soon that this was a serious error in judgement on
you part and will not be something you do again in a hurry.

But *how fucking dare you?*

Who the fuck do you think you are to play a game with my life?

You might be some self-appointed nazi-hater dipstick and believe you are an
some sort of mission - but to the outside world you are just a deranged and
unhinged fuckhead with no common decency whatsoever.

Obviously you want to play with me, so lets play Roberto.

I am now going to turn MY attention to YOU and doing a little "exposing" of
my own.

I notice you work for Siemens as a "Contract Manager" - you really are a
big-time being an EMPLOYEE and must be pulling down the big bucks - lol
Lets hope you are really secure in your job, it might be a shame to be
looking for new employment during a global recession. Of course having
retired at 42, I have no such worries.

Well lets also hope that Siemens don't mind being associated with an
employee that will be soon gaining a very prominent profile across the
internet for all the wrong reasons.

Presumably, you have the support of your employer for your extra-curricular
activities? You will soon be needing it let me assure you.

I hope you will enjoy what I have planned for you Roberto. I sat up for
three hours deciding how to respond to your terrorism and decided that
fuckers like you rarely understand anything but direct action - so that is
what you are getting. 100%

So I just registered www.RobertMuehlenkam.com and have ordered an nice new
website to be constructed, just in your honor Roberto.

You see, as you are obviously such a special person, the world really should
know EVERYTHING there is to know about you, your views and your personal
life. I intend to go DEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEP buddy. Real deep.

To make sure the site comes up as in the first page of

Re: You gutless sociopath!
...
Tue, February 16, 2010 2:24:36 PM
From:
Guadalupe Salcedo [Chat now]
...
View Contact
To: Richard Axxxx
Hi Mr. Axxxx,

While I had no intention to "expose" you when addressing you by your last name (which I though was "Axxxx" after reading it in an e-mail message of yours somewhere on the RODOH board, sorry for the mistake), I cannot help laughing at your hysterical reaction and the silly threats you're sending my way.

So you want to "expose" me to my employers. Just go ahead, you'll be telling them nothing they don't know already, and it doesn't look like they have a problem with one of their employees fighting Holocaust denial in his spare time, which may even be considered an act of social responsibility. If I were a Holocaust denier they would pull my ears, but I would also have no problem with your trying to defame me in this sense, as I can easily prove that I'm on the side of the good guys. If you bother my employers with your story, they will probably tell you that they don't mind my activities as long as they don't interfere with my work productivity, as a former hierarchical superior told me once in the same context. And if you pester them too much, they will probably send their legal advisers your way.

So you want to open a website to bitch around about me? Just go ahead, you'll only be increasing my ratings and showing everybody that you are a mentally unbalanced person desperately in need of psychiatric assistance. I'll look in and have a laugh about your nonsense every once in a while, on the HC blog or wherever else I consider appropriate.

You want to "bury" into my personal life? There's nothing to hide there, so whoever you want to "expose" me to will get bored pretty soon. Unless you want to indulge in libel and defamation, that is. If this should be your intention, I trust you will at least be man enough to send me your address so I can take the proper legal steps against such activity.

That said, I would like to give you some friendly advice: go see a psychiatrist. From what your writings have revealed and what I little know about psychiatry, I'd say you suffer from a serious case of schizophrenia, with what I think is called egomania (everything revolves around you) and paranoia (everybody is after you and wants to do you some harm) as the outstanding symptoms. For your own sake and for the sake of your environment, you should do something about your malady. And rest assured that I'll be glad to hear of your therapeutic progress.

With my best regards,

Roberto Muehlenkamp

Re: You gutless sociopath!
...
Tue, February 16, 2010 5:00:41 PM
From:
Richard Axxxx
...
View Contact
To: Guadalupe Salcedo
We will see who is laughing shortly, wheels are in motion buddy...

"While I had no intention to "expose" you when addressing you by your last name..." Pull the other one you lying sack of shit - you clearly had the intention to "expose" me or the silly fucking thought of using my name would never have occurred to you. As my friend commented today - "what sort of sick individual would do something like that?" - Answer is YOU!

Go look at your ugly face in the mirror and see for yourself.

The methods you employ to debase arguments are patently transparent to even the casual observer.

I simply tried to generate some debate but you and your ilk have no time for others opinions if they don't agree with yours, despite the stated purpose of the forum. You are the very fucking definition of intolerance which is the very Shiite that is preached by church of the true "believers" - ie. dips like you that have no objectivity whatsoever; so you decided to "out" me.

Please explain your thought process that lead you to deciding to post my name? What exactly was you motivation? Where was your provocation?

Now you have the affront to threaten legal action on the basis that I might post some "opinions" about you online, when you are your other "special" friend Sergy were happy to defame me by calling me an anti-semite and using my name. This is called defamation here in the UK where we have some of the best legislation in the world.

So if this is the path you would like to follow, I am more than willing. You better realize that this is no idle threat and WILL actually involve you spending real money once the process starts.

I assume you will be divulging your real name and contact details and your Solicitor's (if you actually have one) so we can get started within 48 hours?

I am course am more than happy to give you full details and will instruct my Solicitor to make contact with yours. But I will wager that you will ignore this as your threats are as valid as your advice - you are a therapist now I see...

What you don't really seem to grasp is that I DONT GIVE A FUCK ABOUT YOU OR JEWS OR REVISIONISTS OR THE HOLOCAUST. FULL STOP!

I do however care about my reputation and will defend it at all costs.

I also care about TRUTH IN HISTORY unlike you and your "you agree with us - or you are against us" dipsticks that want the rest of us to believe whatever you conclude with questions. Sorry but I want my kids to engage in real debate not be force-fed by the self-appointed high-priests of history like you.

What is your actual link to this debate - are you Jewish by any chance?

GET OVER YOURSELF - YOU ARE A NOBODY and most people could not give a flying fuck about the bile your spout or your opinions.

You are a deluded sociopath, plain and simple.

I, on the other hand am a retired (at 42) entrepreneur who is financially secure, own a property portfolio and have investments that generate more than enough for me to never work another day in my life maintaining a lifestyle that makes losers like you bitter. I have have patents registered for two of my inventions that earn me substantial royalties annually, have had 4 highly successful businesses and employed 213 people in the course of my life; making two of them rich enough to also retire before 50.

I studied psychology in my spare time in order to help people in need and worked for a year for a charity for nominal wage to give something back to my community. I am now supporting a not-for-profit historical research project that is aimed at HELPING people learn history in a new way; not only with my time, but financially as well. Five years ago I founded a charity that recycles obsolete computer equipment and software from Australian businesses for free distribution to orphanages in Nairobi with the aim to assist children to learn valuable new skills. To date we have delivered over 13,000 IT components to twelve different community projects.

In other words, I am a success story - a contributing member of society. Your "opinions" therefore are rendered invalid by the facts, which is why I suspect you have launched such an attack - because people like you are scared of objective people like me as we often expose your "opinions" as bullshit by the very nature of our approach, Just the Truth!

So you call us anti-semite. Fuck you, the horse you rode in on and Chana the liar too!

So what the hell have you ever done, other that post your pathetic opinions on FEEE FORUMS?

I mean you believe in your cause so much you cant even invest in your own website like a typical freeloader!

I have checked you out and so far - a big fat NOTHING!

A mouthpiece is all you will be remembered as.

So I will be waiting for your Solicitor's details then...

Re: You gutless sociopath!
...
Tue, February 16, 2010 5:38:50 PM
From:
Richard Axxxx
...
View Contact
To: Guadalupe Salcedo
Roberto

As a side issue, I guess it was just coincidence that my gmail account got hacked at the same time was it?

Pull the other one!

The Met Police in London were notified this morning as this is a criminal offense in the UK and were supplied with your IP address (isn't technology great) as you are the only suspect.

As a direct consequence of this unauthorized access, my entire project team had to implement new security measures which are expected to cost in the vicinity of £2500 and our project manager suggests you were at the very least "recklessly indifferent" by your actions and wants to pursue you for costs.

I guess you wont be remaining anonymous for long...

I am still waiting for your Solicitor's details....

Re: You gutless sociopath!
...
Tue, February 16, 2010 5:56:51 PM
From:
Guadalupe Salcedo [Chat now]
...
View Contact
To: Richard Axxxx
Project team? I thought you had retired.

I'll let you into a little secret, Mr. Axxxx.

I couldn't hack anything even if I tried. I'm not too bad at handling a PC from a user's perspective, but that sums up my computer skills.

If you have money to waste on pointless legal actions, just go and throw it out of the window. It's your problem, not mine.

And I suggest you stop sending me these ridiculous threatening e-mails. I think that's called harrassment and would entitle me to take legal steps against you.

Cheers,
Roberto

Re: You gutless sociopath!
...
Tue, February 16, 2010 6:15:45 PM
From:
Richard Axxxx
...
View Contact
To: Guadalupe Salcedo
Hey Roberto, check out the new website updates...

Nice to finally talk to you personally and I am glad you are taking this as a joke! After all you are one of the self-appointed "good-guys" - a super-hero masquerading as a regular guy. More people in your position should have your unique sense of humor.

So I am able to update your BIO, do you have any non-Jewish causes you support?

Also, for the record, how did you become involved in debating Holocaust revisionists?
I have seen some suggestions online, but I would rather hear it directly from you - wouldn't want any stray "opinions" on your very own website would we?

Latest news is that tomorrow we will have the blog and guestbook up on the site - how exciting for you. We can even run opinion polls!

Looking forward to your feedback.

Best regards

Richard

Re: You gutless sociopath!
...
Tue, February 16, 2010 7:14:46 PM
From:
Richard Axxxx
...
View Contact
To: Guadalupe Salcedo
Roberto,

You were the one threatening legal action I simply accepted.

You have, as I suspected been blowing more hot air around with no intention of carrying through; but I warn you, that wont deter me from my new project.

However I am a reasonable man so any time you feel like offering me a sincere apology and providing the assurance that you and your dipstick buddy will never again attempt to defame or insult me publicly me in future, I will quite happily get back to my project and have nothing further to do with you.

I might even give you this website as a gift, you never know...

And by the way, I donate my time to a project that I believe is worthwhile as I want to give something back to society as a WHOLE and no longer want the pressures of being involved in a commercial enterprise. If you and your "believer" dips could over yourselves, you might actually see that a project like the one I am contributing to could be a great asset to you - after all the Holocaust did happen didn't it, so what are you so afraid of?

Have you ever stopped to consider that the way you act makes reasonable people think you have something to hide or you have no real faith in your beliefs - just obsession. As things stand for now however your side has had nothing but negativity and insults to offer, ZERO contributions but lots of paranoid inferences. Nice work as the revisionist have already been contributing and have requested 3 new databases. You morons even used this as a basis for claiming it was a revisionist site; even going so far as to infer that the statements at the bottom of EVERY page were some sort of ruse to fool you (like anyone really gives a shit about a bunch of circle-jerkers and fooling them - most people take statements like that at face value as expected), and if we called another site TreblinkaTransitCamp.com instead of DeathCamp like we DID, we would have to JUSTIFY this. To whom exactly? The RODOH members?

What planet are you people on?

If we were "revisionists" we would redirect the DeathCamp to TransitCamp and explain why the death camp stuff is all bullshit - only we are NOT.

Do yourself a favor and actually read the info on the websites and my posts about the project you might finally grasp what we are trying to achieve and why Treblinka was chosen as a test database and site. No conspiracy, just clever PR by starting with a controversial topic and stimulating debate to generate interest in the project with negligible costs.

But then we never expected to encounter a forum like RODOH or people like you or your buddy Sergy.

Just so you know we were advised today that it wold take one communication from our Solicitors to yuku.com to have the RODOH forum removed from their servers immediately and probably for good. However they responded promptly and acted in good faith to remedy the situation so we saw no point in taking it further.

Would have been a great score for us if we were really revisionists and anti-semites wouldn't it?

It is also rather interesting that this (the project) was the only part of my message you focused upon - and reminiscent of how that RODOH forum operates. It's called cherry-picking and you are a consummate master. You would not last one second in a court-room my friend with your approach - unless it was one of the show-trials you so love to rely upon.

The ball is in your court...

Best regards

Richard

Re: You gutless sociopath!
...
Thu, February 18, 2010 2:18:35 PM
From:
Guadalupe Salcedo [Chat now]
...
View Contact
To: Richard Axxxx
http://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2010/02/owner-of-this-website.html

From: Guadalupe Salcedo
To: Richard Axxxx
Sent: Tue, February 16, 2010 8:00:35 PM
Subject: Re: You gutless sociopath!

PS: That would be "laugh their heads off". Sorry for the mistake. English is not my native language.

From: Guadalupe Salcedo
To: Richard Axxxx
Sent: Tue, February 16, 2010 7:59:13 PM
Subject: Re: You gutless sociopath!

I threatened legal action? There's your paranoia again, Mr. Amies.

An easier way to keep you from clogging my mailbox with your trash is to make all of it public for the folks to laugh their heads of about it.

Which is what I will do upon receiving your next message.

Cheers,
Roberto

Re: You gutless sociopath!
...
Thu, February 18, 2010 9:45:57 PM
From:
Richard Axxxx
...
View Contact
To: Guadalupe Salcedo
Dear Roberto.

I appreciate your posts on your blog. Seems you are a remorseless idiot and delusional to boot.

Let me break this down for you so you actually get it and stop embarrassing yourself with your posts.

1/ I don't own the www.hsrdb.com website you ignoramus - and you will be on the receiving end of a little bit of legal action yourself if you repeat this accusation again publicly considering your "outing" of my "name" that was linked to your associate's claims of aniti-semitism: is this clear enough for you?

We are still waiting for your Solicitor's details........................................................... and waiting...............................and waiting...............................

Have you ever heard of whois?

Just like your other "opinions" expressed online this is also exposed as complete BULLSHIT when compared to the facts.

You are FULL OF SHIT an you know it, but keep on lying anyway.

ONLINE CHALLENGE: Prove I am the owner of www.hsrdb.com and I will give you £1000.00

CAN'T: Then Give ME and HSRDB an APOLOGY you gutless egghead!

Bet you wont - because facts and TRUTH are of NO INTEREST TO YOU.

Furthermore when did I clam to be a Solicitor?

Another "interpretation" of the facts to suit your delusions?

ONLINE CHALLENGE: Prove I claimed to be a Solicitor and I will give you £1000.00

CAN'T: Then Give ME an APOLOGY you gutless egghead!

Any reasonable person would have understood my outrage at your attempting to "out" me as an anti-semite (a highly offensive and derogatory term) using my "real" name online because I dared express common arguments about the holocaust to generate interest in a website project I was working on. You or your associate hacked my email account and accessed personal and sensitive emails. But not you.

Many hours and thousands of pounds were spend responding to this security threat.

You are so delusional you seem to think this is OK.

You then decide to prove you had no valor whatsoever by blatantly ignoring my clear invitation for an apology to end our dispute, instead posting more BS online via your blog.

Well, now I have have a little something for you and will explain the purpose of the "roberto" website because obviously you are not so bright.

We registered it to get you to visit it. YES YOU - and your IP address - which we captured with EVERY VISIT - after all you would be the only one who would bother to go there. When you did, we captured your IP addresses and are now following up re the security breaches and our Solicitors will be contacting the service providers or owners of the IP. You might not be too popular with them, and they might be like you and not want to hear your "excuses" when forming their opinions. You would not have a problem with this of course as you ADVOCATE DISCRIMINATION AND INTOLERANCE of others.

Enjoy being on the receiving end of your own BS for a change.

And yes - Legal action IS pending as the costs associated with your little stunts have been considerable. We have instructed our Solicitors, Gillams to serve and injection against you, your dipstick buddy Sergy and your service providers. We assume most of your posts will be deleted as a precaution as we are also deliberately being ambiguous in our allegations and demanding all posts be removed. Guess there will only be your website for your followers to log-on to to get updates.

You really are a sucker, you really thought we would defame you in response to your defamation! How stupid do you think we are? Guess you assumed everyone else was as paranoid, obsessional and stupid as you. Sorry buddy, but most of us have a life...

Now for the fun part.

You were provided with a reasonable opportunity to apologize - you ignored it, confirming that you are completely unrepentant about what you did and are clearly an unbalance sociopath as originally suggested.

Your sick intention was to "out" me and my wife and children - you pathetic loser - so more lunatics like you could hopefully abuse us. Motivation?

Scaring me into silence. You are ONE SICK INDIVIDUAL.

So after careful consideration of your response with my buddies over some beers, I realized that indeed, a sociopath like you would not be troubled by exposure of you methods as you actually appear proud of them. You would presumably bask in the attention you received. We don't buy the bullshit about your anonymous employer, but thanks for the advice anyway.

So instead I have donated the site to a New Zealand guy who really likes Adolph Hitler, your hero. He tells me that under his management the site will be devoted to promoting his idol and supporting the revisionists arguments and a up-to-date source of news articles critical of your cause. Emails and forums are great as me@roberto... might start popping up with posts in the most unusual places. Absolutely no defamation of course.

You must be so excited!

Now comes the booby-prize for you.

Axxxx or Axxxx is NOT MY NAME you idiot. But I am starting to gather that we have yours right.

RichardAxxxx68@gmail.com is a DUMMY NAME used by our contributors to enter forums - DUH!!!!!!

The arguments used were selected from contributions from another forum - a PSYCHOLOGY FORUM. Anti-semitic ? You fucking idiots invented this BS and now you reject others using your own arguments....

By the way, you would have to be the BIGGEST IDIOT we have encountered during this project and have provided PROOF that some Jewish Holocaust supports are mentally unbalanced in their obsession with their "cause" and do their cause more harm than good. You have swallowed your own shit and it has made you sick - my advice to you is to get some help before you destroy your life and have a heart attack.

As for the project as I think I told you before, I could not give a fuck what you try to do; you will only make a fool of yourself and probably get sued as you ARE a resident of the EU you tosser and have already stepped over the line. Keep clocking up the actions dipstick.

Clearly you like playing with fire so you must be expecting to get burned. "Cause and effect"? lol

Bets regards, "Richard"

PS I am posting this on you forums so everyone can see what a Dickhead you are...

In one respect I fully agree with "success story" Richard: his vaunted database is no threat whatsoever to the historical record of mass murder at Treblinka extermination camp. Historiography and criminal justice (both of which Richard obviously knows as much about as a pig does about Sunday) have long learned how to deal with the "gross inconsistencies" that Richard makes a fuss and to put together an accurate account of events by crosschecking eyewitness testimonies against each other and against evidence of other categories. What Richard intends to do will rather benefit opponents of the "Revisionist" faith by putting at their disposal a handy collection of eyewitness accounts and other material about Treblinka. Absence of distortions provided, I may find things there to add to my collection of Treblinka eyewitness accounts, for instance. In this sense, Richard's work may well become a shot in the foot of "Revisionism", similar to those of Messrs. Krege and Mattogno. So please keep it up, Richard!

Ever seen a live meltdown?

2010-02-18T15:48:00.001-08:00

Look no further: Richard aka JustTheTruth has one here, here, here, here and here. He doesn't even hide it anymore.

The owner of http://www.hsrdb.com ...

2010-02-18T05:08:00.001-08:00

... is obviously a very sick person in urgent need of psychiatric assistance, judging by the threatening and/or just plain silly e-mails he has sent me, and by another website he recently created, as he told me he would.

On this other website, said person spouts some rather amusing nonsense about my person. Among other things, he attributes to me claims/opinions ("He also claims to be a Solicitor", "seems to believe that if you simply ask a question about the Holocaust (a subject very precious to him) that you are automatically an ANTI-SEMITE") that I don't remember having made or expressed (perhaps he's mixing me up with someone else), besides calling me names (including the obviously self-projecting "sociopath"), insinuating that I am not "consistent" about my identity and claiming that my employer (who he didn't find out about through me) denies to employ me.

In sum, said person shows the kind of confused, hysterical, mendacious and paranoid behavior that characterizes certain inhabitants of "Revisionist" cloud-cuckoo-land I have come across, though he exceeds most of them.

Said person is hereby required to remove his aforementioned other website until 20 hours GMT of today, 18.02.2010.

Should he fail to do so, I shall

a) make public the e-mail messages he sent me, and

b) track him down to obtain what satisfaction for his libel/defamation I am legally entitled to.

Should it turn out that said person is not responsible for his actions due to insanity, I shall recommend to the appropriate authorities his internment in a mental health institution.

Guadalupe Salcedo, by the way, was a Colombian guerrilla leader in the 1950s. My featuring his name in my private e-mail address is a homage to this gentleman and to the country where I was born and raised.

http://www.hsrdb.com: Legitmate Revision or Denial?

2010-02-16T07:22:00.001-08:00

This site [screenshot] claims that

This is NOT a Holocaust denial website, it is a FACT that the Holocaust happened.

How sincere is this claim? And why is it being made in the first place?

The site claims that its aim is "to assist historians, scholars and students interested in analyzing and comparing historical information". The original name of the site, obtained by Googling its mailing address, was Legitimate Revision [screenshots a, b]. We are of course wholly in favour of legitimate revision, but we might be curious as to why the site changed its name.

The answer is that one of the founders of the site is the Holocaust "revisionist" [screenshot] "JustTheTruth", who has posted comments to the HC blog using the name Richard. We know that JTT=Richard for two reasons. First of all, just like JTT, he had known about the "database" project before it was revealed. He also repeated some of Richard's specific arguments about Treblinka at CODOH. The second reason is irrefutable evidence which we will not post at this time, although it is publicly available, as it concerns Richard's private life. We made sure to save all of it, though, because Richard has made threats against RODOH and individual posters there.

For now, let's just note this public WHOIS information for HSRDB site [screenshot]:

Registrant:
Richard Lauren
329 Harrow Road
London, London W9 3RB
GB
Domain name: HSRDB.COM

On February 1st, Richard posted this [screenshot] at HC:

Just wait until this new database that cross-references ALL the witness testimonies about these topics in one report goes online - the gross inconsistencies will be exposed once and for all.

We will see exactly "who said what" about the means of gas production in one report - all source-referenced to eliminate disputes.

I cant wait...

Five days later he posted this at CODOH in response to the author of "One Third of the Holocaust" denial videos (debunked by us) [screenshot]:

by JustTheTruth » Sat Feb 06, 2010 8:32 am

Hi Carto's Cutlass Supreme,

Interesting suggestion, thanks.

I am presently working on a project that uses a database with a web interface that allows the cross-referencing of historical sources regarding a particular topic of interest. The first is for Treblinka, so for example, shortly it will be able to produce reports that have quotes from every known testimony in relation to the Treblinka gas chambers and their engines etc; available by search menu.

Eventually it will cover every important aspect of the Treblinka camp - exposing the numerous contradictions in testimony. And if successful, databases can be also be created for all the important camps of the Holocaust.

The hope is for it to be a free research tool for historians and revisionists and student, so if it works as expected, I will see if I can make one for the Boder interviews. I'll keep you updated.

If you are interested in playing with the "beta" database, let me know...

Richard/JTT thus reveals that the real purpose of the site is "exposing the numerous contradictions in testimony".

This same person has posted threads at CODOH [screenshot] and RODOH [thread moved; screenshots a, b] that claim that the Jews were responsible for the actions the Nazis inflicted upon them:

Surely it is reasonable to argue that if the Jew's, by their own admission, willingly and deliberately engage in a course of conduct that they are acutely aware has resulted in repeated persecutions to those engaging in said conduct; they are, by doing so, instigating and provoking a an anticipated result and as such are directly responsible for any consequences thereof.

And:

No people ever DESERVE to be treated as the Jews were by the Nazis; however is it wrong to suggest that they CONTRIBUTED?

In legal terms this is called PROVOCATION which, in many jurisdictions, forms the basis for a lawful defenses to criminal charges such as assault.

Therefore in many legal jurisdictions, knowingly and deliberately engaging in such a course of conduct that provokes another party, implies consent regarding the actions of that party resulting from said conduct.

[...]

Without some sort of prior obligation or responsibility of host nations for the well-being of their Jewish guests, the Jewish peoples have no right to conduct themselves in a manner that is antagonistic toward their hosts. Am I wrong here?

One must ask why the Jewish people continue to blatantly conduct themselves in such a way that has seen their repeated persecuted throughout history?

How does the often warped logic of the holocaust manage to turn this fundamental principle of cause-and-effect on it's head so that people like you are prepared to debate it?

Stop for one second and ask yourself if you would tolerate a houseguest conducting themselves in a manner that showed that they had no respect for you, your family, your property, your traditions or your implied house rules?

You would kick them out, plain and simple. No need for "hate" or anti-anything for this simple trait of human nature to be evoked as the resident RODOH psychotherapist should well know. Am I wrong here?

(anyone who is silly enough to answer yes, please find the nearest homeless person and open up your home to them - no rule, no restrictions and then bask in the glory of knowing your are not an "anti-vagrant" like all the rest of us)

And:

Sorry if I am losing you with my explanation that I am just a normal guy, not a NAZI. I am sure you would just love me to be one of these nuts, just to suit you own idiotic rational that anyone who challenges that Holocuast is one.

(He admits he "challenges" the Holocaust.)

And:

No I was referring to Sergys use of it to somehow describe anti-semitism which could never be honestly achieved by a Jewish writer.

Etc., etc.

The site's bogus claim of neutrality can also be shown by its list of preferred topics [screenshot], where we have "Amazing Stories: German Kindness". Interestingly, there is even "Treblinka Zoo" on the list. Denier obsession with minor allegedly absurd things in camps is also known, and Treblinka zoo is one of them, as this posting by denier "Saggy" at JREF Forum shows. In any case, the lack of veracity of the "database" is shown by the fact that its list of alleged diesel gassing witnesses includes historian Poliakov and journalist Grossman who were never interned in the camp.

CODOH: The Forum That Moderated Itself to Death

2010-02-12T09:12:00.001-08:00

by Jason Willis Myers

[Jason posted at different Internet forums for quite some time as "Wahrheit" and "Wahrheitseeker". Until recently he was a Holocaust denier. His voluminous output at CODOH, RODOH and elsewhere prevents any suspicion of him being an anti-"revisionist" mole. He was also one of the people at the root of "Inconvenient History" blog, though his contributions seem to have vanished. Not so long ago he has changed his views - a story to be told in the future, that's for sure.

We think that what Jason has to say in this article is interesting and instructive.

Note that HC team does not necessarily agree with opinions expressed by our guest bloggers or guarantee the accuracy of all their claims.]

CODOH: The Forum That Moderated Itself to Death

On February 8, 2010 I was permanently banned from the CODOH Revisionist forum. Ostensibly, the justification for my ban was my "pre-meditated" change of heart regarding the veracity of the "Holocaust tale", and my efforts to "dupe" CODOH readers.

That I had been a revisionist from 2005 to fall 2009 is clear, but after further study of the relevant literature, I decided that the evidence for a Nazi program of extermination was simply too overwhelming to deny any longer. More will be said of my change at a later time, but after hundreds of posts at the CODOH, RODOH, and History Channel forums arguing the revisionist case, and much work behind the scenes on various revisionist projects, I find the charge that I was "faking" as a revisionist the whole time to be ridiculous, to say the least.

The treatment I received at CODOH forum was no exception to the longtime rule. By the very nature of CODOH forum's guidelines, open debate was set up to fail. Posts are only allowed to contain one point, and thus, are inherently un-historical in their approach; one cannot honestly discuss history by forbidding the analysis of an event's context. Other rules do not appear as malignant, but are applied selectively, and are employed as a tool to rig debates.

Although name-calling is officially forbidden, one can easily search the forum and find many vile remarks regarding "believers" (the word "denier," in contrast, is prohibited); regarding the name-calling of revisionist posters and writers, however, this rule is strongly enforced. The same selective enforcement occurs regarding the "no dodging" instructions. Revisionist posters are freely able to "dodge" my Transit Camp Treblinka Challenge (which is the longest thread on the CODOH forum, yet still is without an answer to the original post), but any mention of a murdered Jew, without overwhelming forensic evidence to rely upon (and only forensic evidence!) is seen as "dodging." That the forum moderator (who posts under the handle "Hannover," a devious effort typically seen as sock-puppetry) also dodges posts can be seen in my thread on Thies Christophersen, wherein he ignores all my points on Christophersen, creates straw men, and bloviates about revisionism in general.

Of course, I have long been aware of the unfair moderating practices at the CODOH forum. On November 2, 2008, while I was still a revisionist, I complained to CODOH regarding their forum's moderating policies (whole email is attached as an appendix for open disclosure). In that email, I wrote:

"I am afraid if something is not done to keep the Revisionist forum up to the standards of "open" debate, many more posters will also pack their bags and take their game elsewhere. At such a dismal time in the revisionism movement, where leaders such as Rudolf, Zundel, and Toben are in European jails, one must keep the community as active and as large as possible. Shunting different revisionist ideas, and limiting the "open" nature of debate is detrimental to our movement, and threatens the very lifeblood in times such as these."

Since November 2008, the situation at the CODOH forum has only continued to deteriorate. Despite the forum's eight year lifespan, it still has not reached 500 total posters; the 470+ that it currently has overwhelmingly arrived some years ago, with only a trickle of new posters coming in now; indeed, only a small fraction of the total posters still appear on a regular basis. Numerous posters (mostly revisionists) have left the forum because of the heavy-handed moderating practices. No other forum involved with Holocaust discussions (including revisionist arguments) has such a tendency to delete unwanted posts.

There are some who have stuck around the CODOH forum and have enjoyed the isolation of their posts, free from criticism, but every month brings about an increasing number of posters who turn their back on the CODOH forum, or at least voice their opposition to the moderator's policies.

In other words, the CODOH Revisionist forum is dying.

Now, such a sad state of affairs for revisionism could have easily been avoided by the CODOH leadership had founder Bradley Smith or Editor-in-Chief Richard Widmann (both of whom I respect) taken a different approach to the CODOH Revisionist forum.

CODOH's Indifference

I have long believed in the fruitfulness of combined research efforts. In late 2008, given the poor state of revisionist research (Mattogno still is the lone researcher), and the failure to keep information moving at the same pace as Germar Rudolf once did, I thought something had to be done. As a revisionist, I tried to spawn new efforts to get things moving again (such was my conviction at the time).

My initial aim was to establish a revisionist blog (now the Inconvenient History blog), which could help accumulate various articles, information of interest, and spur more discussion and interest in Holocaust revisionism as a whole. After gathering a preliminary group of contributors for the blog, we contacted CODOH for logistical support in hosting a website for us.

My initial proposal to Bradley Smith came on November 7, 2008. After some discussion with him and CODOH editor Richard Widmann, CODOH formally agreed to host our blog. One of our main warnings to CODOH, however, was that our blog would be run independently, and would be allowed to post whatever revisionist views we wished, including critical reviews of revisionist research. Going off of our experience with the CODOH forum, and by the very nature of the relationship, we felt justified in our terms and our caution in working with CODOH.

Richard Widmann responded to our terms as follows (only relevant portions quoted - email dated November 9, 2008):

"CODOH is not dogmatic in its views and I think would provide you the latitude you are seeking.

The CODOH Forum is not CODOH. It is largely the work and effort of the moderator there whom I assume you know. He has tremendous freedom to do what he wants-and what he does is certainly different than what I would do. The key is however that he does it. It is not something I have the time nor the stomach for.

(...)

I am interested to know why you might think us "Close-minded" or dogmatic in this area. I know of no one less so in the entire debate on either side.

SO in short-yes you could do your own thing. The only intervening I recall through the years with regard to the Forum has been requesting to allow more posts to be posted and to stop a campaign which called for the banning of the work of David Irving."

Bradley Smith emailed a similar comment (dated November 11, 2008):

"Widman speaks for me here on all points.

I have always been especially interested in the revisionist criticism of published H. revisionism. have always thought it a weakness of CODOH in not having it.

To date we have not had a way of doing this with anything resembling graciousness or generoisity, and without those qualities it is destructive. The Forum is run on a very tight leash, but as Widmann notes, it is run, and has been run for years at considerable risk and personal cost for the primary moderator, and has built up a very large repository of information."

That the two see the CODOH forum as distinctly different from CODOH itself (and thus, not held responsible) is a very misguided view to take, and one that I am at a loss to explain.

The CODOH Revisionist forum acts as the everyday face of CODOH, where discussions with readers progress daily. It is highlighted on CODOH's mainpage, along with a feature that showcases the most recent posts on various threads. In addition, the CODOH name is featured prominently and in numerous locations on the Revisionist forum's website. To deny this connection is simply absurd. Thus, when posters are banned or censored for their views on the Revisionist forum (revisionist or orthodox), CODOH's credibility in defense of "free speech" suffers.

Widmann and Smith's indifference to the ongoing tragedy of "open debate" at their forum (or sponsored forum) also is counterproductive for the revisionist 'movement', for many sane posters have simply left the revisionist scene due to their disenchantment with CODOH's forum.

From an anti-revisionist's perspective, what more could one wish? The revisionist movement is purging itself.

As the cynics would no doubt say, CODOH has passed the point of open debate and only seeks to pursue its own agenda. Surely the group has a right to protest the criminalization of Holocaust revisionism, as well as the alleged sacredness of the Holocaust taboo on college campuses (see Bradley Smith’s dispute with Harvard), but do they really expect people to take them seriously when they allow blatant censorship in their own backyard? Do as I say, not as I do?

It is sometimes said that cognitive dissonance produces a positive effect in the mind, allowing it to better judge the issues at hand. When the dissonance is not cognized, however, the mind does not progress in its intelligence, and incongruent positions result. Thus, CODOH focuses its efforts on breaking taboos and pushing for more academic freedom regarding the Holocaust, all the while hosting a forum that censors and bans unsought posters’ opinions.

The blissful indifference that Widmann and Smith maintain with their forum (though both are aware of the endless complaints about the moderator) does not bode well for CODOH’s future, nor for Holocaust Revisionism. Without some level of intellectual curiosity, CODOH will become (even more) irrelevant to real historic revisionism; instead, it will become nothing more than a defender of the revisionists’ own dogma.

Like the revisionist posters who wish to escape criticism, CODOH seems to have abandoned its willingness to think.

-Jason Willis Myers

Appendix

from: Truth Seeker <wahrheitseeker@gmail.com>
to: mail_to@codoh.com
date: Sun, Nov 2, 2008 at 12:05 PM
subject: CODOH revisionist forum
mailed-by: gmail.com
hide details 11/2/08

Dear CODOH,

I am an active revisionist poster over at the CODOH forum. I have continually took part in discussions exposing the Holocaust-lie, and have even put together 2-3 serious articles on points which debunk the exterminationist claim (which I must finalize before trying to get posted to the CODOH library).

It is with much regret that I have noticed a serious downturn in the quality of discussion at the CODOH revisionist forum. Many of the former established posters, who actively contribute meaningfull information to the forum (such as Laurentz Dahl) have been ran over by the likes of Greg Gerdes. I agree in principle with the claims of Gerdes, and the demands for proof of the Reinhard camps, but any slight deviation of Gerdes' position always leads to constant beratement and incessant attacks. Laurentz Dahl left the forum becaue of him, and Carlo Cutlass Supreme has also suffered from his tactics.

Also, Dr Joachim Neander (an open-minded believer) has also continually suffered beratement at the hands of a few: 'Hannover', 'Turpitz', etc...Posters of quality and intelligence such as Neander should try to be held onto as much as possible, but yet in any post he makes, he is attacked for being a "believer". This is not healthy for the supposed "open" debate of the forum.

Not to mention, I too have suffered a spell of censorship by the moderator. I did nothing wrong, and was very polite in my posts. I responded to points raised in a thread, but was told that my arguments have already been dealt with in other threads. When I visited those threads, and posted my points again, I still have been censored and told that I am posting to already-responded to points. The fact that my points have NOT been adequately debunked apparently fails to be understood. Rather it is a purposeful effort to shun my ideas which clash with the moderator's notions.

I am afraid if something is not done to keep the Revisionist forum up to the standards of "open" debate, many more posters will also pack their bags and take their game elsewhere. At such a dismal time in the revisionism movement, where leaders such as Rudolf, Zundel, and Toben are in European jails, one must keep the community as active and as large as possible. Shunting different revisionist ideas, and limiting the "open" nature of debate is detrimental to our movement, and threatens the very lifeblood in times such as these.

I am open to any ideas or other questions you may have.

Best Rgds,

W.

Yet another antisemitic Nazi-lover writing for "Inconvenient history" blog

2010-02-11T15:54:00.001-08:00

Canadian citizen (German emigre) Wilfried Heink posts at CODOH's "Inconvenient History" blog (see "About us" page and his postings). Recently he wrote the following at RODOH forum (my emphasis):

This is exactly what the National Socialists wanted for Germany, to have a Germany for Germans and to preserve that Aryan bloodline. Here is part of the Nürnberg law:

5. Nur der Deutsche, der sich zur deutschen Kultur – und Schicksalsgemeinschaft bekennt, kann staatsbürgerliche Rechte ausüben

(only those Germans who acknowledges to be part of German culture and destiny can carry out civic duties)

Hitler had the right to decide who lives in Germany and who did not. Jews are never part of the Schicksalsgemeinschaft they live in, regardless of what country it is. Therefore, they are strangers and subject to removal. This is what the National Socialists wanted, the Jews out of Germany. And that is all the Mohawk’s want, I doubt however that they will be allowed to succeed. And we have to remember that the Indians, in spite of all the make believe, are not sovereign nations.

Israel practices this and would get rid of the remaining Palestinians in an instance, but this can not be compared to the situation in Germany, and indeed to that in Quebec. The Jews claiming to be original Hebrews from Judea, or wherever, are not, and have therefore no right to push the aboriginals out. Germany on the other hand has been populated by Germanic tribes for centuries, ditto for the Indians. And yes, if it can be proven that the land I purchased and live on is still land owned by the Indians, I would have to move, but that is another issue altogether.

First there was neo-Nazi Carolyn Yeager [1, 2, 3], now this.

Arme Auschwitz-Leugner.

Greg Gerdes' latest "wisdom" ...

2010-02-02T10:17:00.001-08:00

... can be read in his CODOH thread A LITERAL 'MASS GRAVES' CONSPIRACY.

My comments about this thread are in the thread Greg Gerdes’ latest: «A LITERAL 'MASS GRAVES' CONSPIRACY» of the RODOH forum.

I thank Mr. Gerdes for having given me this opportunity to provide an overview of evidence regarding the mass graves at Chelmno and the Aktion Reinhard(t) camps Belzec, Sobibor and Treblinka, which is surely of interest to our readers.

Carmelo Does CODOH!

2010-01-24T18:18:00.001-08:00

Very fittingly, Carmelo Lisciotto (of holocaustresearchproject.org) descended into the Cesspit to promote his fake blogs there.

Clickie here, here or here. [Note: links expired, see screenshots below]

Dr. Terry immediately sets him straight:

Hi Carmelo,

I'm surprised you are still crusading about something that happened in 2006, and on a revisionist site to boot, or did you switch sides? You used to put up fake blogs claiming that Sergey Romanov was a Holocaust denier, yet here you are on CODOH talking about 'hoaxers' running the ARC site.

Incidentally, I was merely a collateral casualty of a feud between other people. I belonged to the ARC group for a few months, contributed nothing, and lost nothing much when I was histrionically booted out for having done absolutely nothing. Can't say I particularly care, but evidently the internet is such a serious business for you that you do.

And poor Cesspit Clown Carto's Cutlass Supreme is aloof and out of touch, as usual:

I have to say that someone starting death-camps.org to imitate and confuse with deathcamps.org seems dishonest to me.

That would be dishonest indeed, if not for the fact that death-camps.org was set up by ARC members who disagreed with Chris Webb's and Carmelo Lisciotto's policy of promoting fake documents on deathcamps.org (as described here). The intent was to preserve the authentic information, cleared from "Andy Schmidt's" forgeries.

Carmelo Lisciotto should stay at CODOH. Holocaust deniers are a fitting company for him.

PS: Carmelo's spam was deleted, as had been expected. Here's a screenshot of just one of his spam messages, in which Lisciotto tries to suck up to Holocaust deniers and to attack Dr. Nicholas Terry:

Here is another, in which Carmelo promotes his fake blogs:

Closed Debate is Open Debate

2010-01-22T06:03:00.001-08:00

Deniers often claim that the Holocaust 'industry' is 'Orwellian'. But it is our old friend Jonnie Hargis who practices the ultimate form of Doublethink on the subject of free speech. He states here that:

I can't think of any regular at this forum that hasn't had a post deleted for one reason or an other. You have to understand that the emphasis here is on debate that is free of subject changing, distortion, namecalling, and dodging, etc. Without our very basic guidelines (which are not unusual, they are generally found in moderated debates), we would end up with very confusing threads ... unfortunately that is exactly what some desire.

The Committee for Open Debate on the Holocaust is therefore promoting closed debate.

The most blatant form of closure is the Catch 22 whereby posters are restricted to 'one point, one post', yet someone who strings together several posts, each containing a relevant point, will earn a ban, as Roberto found out here. This closed moderation style makes it impossible to demonstrate relationships and convergences between pieces of evidence. It deliberately generates the assumption that the only true sample is a sample of 1. It is thus the equivalent of limiting a prosecuting attorney to one exhibit or one witness in his closing statement, and not allowing him to infer any relationships between the pieces of evidence he presented during the trial. Conversely, this sample of 1 is then used to negate all the evidence that is not in the sample, on 'falsus in uno, falsus in omnibus' grounds.

CODOH has a paranoid approach to the 'integrity' of documents but what about the integrity of its own debate threads? In the light of Hargis's admission that he "can't think of any regular at this forum that hasn't had a post deleted", how can we trust any thread on CODOH as representing an accurate record of the discussion?

If Hargis had been living in Moscow in the 1930's, Stalin would have given him a job as editor of the party newspaper.

When a denier accepts Hargis's rules, he has learned to love Big Brother.

Is this fellow dumb ...

2010-01-21T03:42:00.001-08:00

... or just playing dumb?

In his CODOH post of Thu Jan 21, 2010 1:12 am, Drew J triumphantly comments:

Blatt is claiming a diesel engine was used for murder. That's funny. I thought Roberto and Sergy already declared the diesel engine moot and were instead trying to focus on petrol engines as the real culprit instead.

Drew J either is feigning that he doesn't understand or still hasn't understood the point made by Sergey in his article Why the "diesel issue" is irrelevant, which is that knowledgeable eyewitnesses (i.e. gassing engine operators, mechanics and others closely familiar with the gassing engine and the gassing process, as opposed to witnesses who had just briefly observed a gassing or only had second-hand knowledge of how gassing was done) always spoke of a gasoline and never of a diesel engine. Casual or second-hand witnesses not familiar with the gassing engine and the gassing process often (though not always) spoke of a diesel engine, but they can easily have mixed up the gassing engine with a diesel engine used for non-homicidal purposes (like power generation) or relied on the accounts of guards or fellow inmates who were thusly mistaken, and the testimonies of such witnesses are therefore irrelevant as concerns this particular aspect, the type of engine used for gassing.

Thomas Blatt was one such casual or second-hand witness as concerns the gassing engine and the gassing process, for he never saw the extermination area of Sobibor (which was rigorously separated from the rest of the camp, and from which there were no survivors) from the inside, as Sergey pointed out in his RODOH post 10765:

Ah, no, he heard no such thing. I don't know whether Blatt said "submarine" or whether it was the journalist's distortion, but Blatt wouldn't know it's submarine in any case - he never was in the extermination zone and the Nazis clearly testified about the gasoline engine. So you miss again. (There was a diesel engine for generating electricity nearby the gassing engine according to Hoedl, but that's that.)

So there's no banana for Drew J and other "Revisionists" idiotically rejoicing over Thomas Blatt's mention of a diesel engine. Sergey's point stands. The diesel issue is irrelevant.

Drew J then flashes back to a former post from our discussions in which he wrote on CODOH and I wrote on this blog or on RODOH, namely his post of Thu Oct 08, 2009 6:11 pm that was commented in my RODOH post # 11503. He seems to be taking advantage of my enforced temporary absence from the CODOH forum to shoot the bull about my arguments. It speaks volumes about his character.

"The People Got Together And Look What Happened"

2010-01-20T09:17:00.001-08:00

Joachim Neander's excellent article Irene Zisblatt, the "Diamond Girl" - Fact or Fiction? got this euphoric eulogy from CODOH poster "Carto's Cutlass Supreme" (who seems to be identical with our old friend "denierbud").

CCS refrained from posting the link to Dr. Neander's article, however.

Maybe he's concerned that his fellow posters, when reading the whole article, will painfully notice the difference between proper scholarship and "Revisionist" pseudo-scholarship.

Or discover that Dr. Neander, after citing "the most important researcher of all regarding this: Eric Hunt" (CCS), described how he used Hunt's document collection to reconstruct Mrs. Zisblatt's actual biography, which is nothing for "Revisionists" to be happy about:

Final conclusion

My research clearly shows that Irene Weisberg Zisblatt is not only a survivor of Auschwitz and the Holocaust, but that she, indeed, has an interesting and instructive story to tell. A story of endless humiliations and extreme suffering, but also of survival against all odds. It would be similar to those that hundreds of survivors can tell or have already told. It certainly would be less adventurous than that which she tells. But it would be in accordance with the historically established facts. Irene Weisberg Zisblatt should tell her story about survival at Auschwitz without exaggerations and implausibilities. It then would be a really true story, worth to be told and retold and to be listened to.

A denier's document collection met a scholar who knew how to use it, and look what happened.

CODOH Censorship Supreme

2010-01-17T16:13:00.001-08:00

Less than a week after my re-admission to the "CODOH Revisionist Forum", my old collection of censored posts has already grown considerably, given that almost everything I posted on CODOH since my readmission has been either deleted after publication or – in most cases – not published at al.

The following screenshots show all but one of my posts that disappeared into the memory hole since I started posting on the CODOH forum last Wednesday.

1. Posts briefly published and then deleted

a) On the thread Muehlenkamp and Mermelstein: post of Wed Jan 13, 2010 7:38 am

b) On the thread DEMJANJUK: Scapegoat for Madness: post of Wed Jan 13, 2010 8.46 am (page 1, page 2, page 3).

2. Posts that were never published

a) On the thread Swimming in Aushwitz!: post submitted on 14.01.2010 at 17:33 hours GMT

b) On the thread DEMJANJUK: Scapegoat for Madness: posts submitted on 14.01.2010 at 13:21 hours GMT (page 1, page 2, page 3, page 4, page 5), at 13:30 hours GMT and at 14:48 hours GMT (page 1, page 2, page 3, page 4, page 5, page 6, page 7, page 8, page 9, page 10, page 11, page 12); posts submitted on 15.01.2010 at 11:44 hours GMT (page 1, page 2) , at 16:13 hours GMT (page 1, page 2) and at 16:51 hours GMT (page 1, page 2, page 3),

In addition to the posts shown in the above screenshots, there is my post submitted on 16.01.2009 at 13:55 hours GMT on the thread DEMJANJUK: Scapegoat for Madness, which also disappeared into the memory hole. Currently the only of one of my post-readmission CODOH posts that is on the board is the one-sentence post of Sun Jan 17, 2010 3:56 pm. I hope it stays there.

11 posts, thereof two published and then deleted by the moderator, 8 retained by the moderator and never published, and only one on the board (at least for the time being). That's "open debate" as practiced by the "Committee for Open Debate on the Holocaust".

Maybe Bradley Smith should change the name of his place to something less hypocritical and more indicative of the cowardly censorship practiced by his forum moderator, who is obviously aware that "Revisionism" is too full of it to prevail in open debate. I suggest something like "Censored Orwellian Debate on the Holocaust", or "Cowardly Deniers of the Holocaust".

Update, 19.01.2010: For ongoing documentation of CODOH censorship on the thread DEMJANJUK: Scapegoat for Madness, see the RODOH thread DEMJANJUK: Scapegoat for Jewish Madness.

Shielding CODOH From Debate

2010-01-15T07:21:00.001-08:00

CODOH Rules state:

Keep your posts limited to one point.

Voluminous, lengthy, and redundant posts are not welcomed.

So how are posters supposed to debate if they are not allowed to cite relationships and convergences between pieces of evidence? Clearly no such meaningful debate is possible, and that is the intention behind the rule: to shield CODOH from true debate.

The Memory Hole Festival started ...

2010-01-14T07:11:00.001-08:00

... with my first post on the "CODOH Revisionist Forum" following my re-admission to that lovely place after a long time of being banned.

My post of Wed Jan 13, 2010 7:38 am briefly appeared on the thread Muehlenkamp and Mermelstein, before the moderator got cold feet and deleted it.

Now let's see what happens on the thread DEMJANJUK: Scapegoat for Jewish Madness, where I currently have three posts waiting for moderator approval ...

Update, 15.01.2010: See my RODOH posts 11806, 11807 and 11808.

What seems plausible to them reflects only their ignorance

2010-01-14T07:07:00.001-08:00

The Cesspit Clown Carto's Cutlass' Supreme (CCCCS) produced this gem:

Yankel Wiernik's book published in The Forward building

by Carto's Cutlass Supreme » Thu Jan 14, 2010 12:07 am

The cover of A Year In Treblinka by Yankel Wiernik states:
Published by AMERICAN REPRESENTATION of the GENERAL JEWISH WORKERS" UNION of POLAND

175 East Broadway

New York, 2, N. Y.
Compare addresses:

See the Wikipedia entry for Forward Magazine. Same address:
At the peak of its popularity, the Forward erected a ten-story office building at 175 East Broadway on the Lower East Side, designed by architect George Boehm and completed in 1912.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Forward

The mouthful of "AMERICAN REPRESENTATION of the GENERAL JEWISH WORKERS" UNION of POLAND" doesn't seem that plausible as a real group. I think this points to the people behind The Forward being the publishers of A Year in Treblinka. And it wouldn't have looked so good had the inside cover said "Published by Forward Magazine."

Then again, had there been such a "American Representation" group, it wouldn't be surprising that they would rent space in the 10 story Forward building.

It seems that even the simplest googling no longer works for these chimps. They don't even try anymore - they just go with what seems plausible or implausible to them, facts be damned. Except given their paranoid mindset and utter ignorance nothing good ever comes out of it.

PS: there is some evidence that CCCCS is the Ugly Voice aka denierbud aka Budly, which makes it all the more funny.

CODOH's Response to the Virginia Tech Massacre

2010-01-12T05:34:00.001-08:00

Anyone seeking an insight into the minds of antisemites will find enlightenment in this CODOH thread, where members frothed at the mouth upon learning that one of the victims was a Holocaust survivor.

The copy of the thread is below. The most interesting parts are emphasized in red.

Virginia Tech holocaust survivor

by vincentferrer » Tue Apr 17, 2007 2:04 pm

One of the victims of the Virginia tech tragedy has been identified as a Holocaust survivor. Listed as 76 years old, this makes the person 8 years old when the war began, and 14 when it ended.

Professor Liviu Librescu an Israeli/Romanian of international stature was among the murdered. It has been reported that Prof. Librescu died while barricading the door of his classroom while his students hid and escaped out of the windows. Prof Librescu, a Holocaust survivor, was murdered on Holocaust Remembrance Day.

The very word holocaust is a pejorative to every German citizen. There was no holocaust, just lies from the abandoned race.

by Ajax » Tue Apr 17, 2007 4:06 pm

You couldn't make it up, could you? Even against the backdrop of this tragedy, they have to get their little word in.

by nashchad » Tue Apr 17, 2007 5:40 pm

http://www.wiesenthal.com/atf/cf/%7BDFD ... ntentSet=0

"My father blocked the doorway with his body and asked the students to flee," Librescu's son, Joe Librescu, said Tuesday in a telephone interview from his home outside Tel Aviv. "Students started opening windows and jumping out."

Huh? I'm not trying to be a hard ass but wouldn't it be more reliable to get an actual eye-witness to this story instead of the deceased man's son who lives in Israel? How could he possibly know anything?

by vincentferrer » Tue Apr 17, 2007 5:44 pm

Who knows if it is made up or not. There are no articles on the net that I found which talk about this person as a holocaust survivor.

Go figure.

The very word holocaust is a pejorative to every German citizen. There was no holocaust, just lies from the abandoned race.

by Goethe » Tue Apr 17, 2007 8:44 pm

Leave to the arrogantly self proclaimed Chosen Ones to fabricate a hero story in an attempt to get the spotlight. Everything must be about them. What we have is a cult of self worship posing as a religion.

by friedrich braun » Tue Apr 17, 2007 10:06 pm

"My father blocked the doorway with his body and asked the students to flee,"

Wow...a Christ-like sacrifice for the greater good. These people never stop impressing.

by Hannover » Tue Apr 17, 2007 11:32 pm

"My father blocked the doorway with his body and asked the students to flee," Librescu's son, Joe Librescu, said Tuesday in a telephone interview from his home outside Tel Aviv. "Students started opening windows and jumping out."

BS. Why wouldn't he just close the door. And the son knows this from 'Israel', right. No doubt the father sent this info. to his son from the great beyond. Pathetic.

'holocaust survivor' not:

Listed as 76 years old, this makes the person 8 years old when the war began, and 14 when it ended.

But according to the standard storyline, all those unable to work, children, elderly, and sick, were supposedly murdered.

My my, how the lies pile up.

- Hannover

by Ajax » Wed Apr 18, 2007 9:46 am

Hannover wrote:But according to the standard storyline, all those unable to work, children, elderly, and sick, were supposedly murdered.

Oh, but they were needed to clean the insides of small metal shell casings...(!)

by stuker » Wed Apr 18, 2007 11:04 pm

There are no articles on the net that I found which talk about this person as a holocaust survivor.

Why would there be?

by Hannover » Thu Apr 19, 2007 12:21 am

stuker wrote:
There are no articles on the net that I found which talk about this person as a holocaust survivor.
Why would there be?

Because so called 'holocaust' survivors crave the limelight and cash they gain from what is truly a scam, and they have a judeo-supremacist media and organizations (like the ADL) to trumpet their unsupportable assertions, that's why.

- Hannover

by Real » Mon Apr 23, 2007 10:03 am

nashchad wrote:Huh? I'm not trying to be a hard ass but wouldn't it be more reliable to get an actual eye-witness to this story instead of the deceased man's son who lives in Israel? How could he possibly know anything?

"Theresa Walsh was one of the last people to see Liviu Librescu alive.

"He looked horrified, almost as if he knew what was going to happen. But he kept all the students behind him so they could get out. "

Walsh said she saw that a lone gunman, ......She said Librescu was peering into the hallway at that moment, keeping his body between the gunman and his students.

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld ... news-print

by Hannover » Mon Apr 23, 2007 10:59 am

Real wrote:
nashchad wrote:Huh? I'm not trying to be a hard ass but wouldn't it be more reliable to get an actual eye-witness to this story instead of the deceased man's son who lives in Israel? How could he possibly know anything?
"Theresa Walsh was one of the last people to see Liviu Librescu alive.

"He looked horrified, almost as if he knew what was going to happen. But he kept all the students behind him so they could get out. "

Walsh said she saw that a lone gunman, ......She said Librescu was peering into the hallway at that moment, keeping his body between the gunman and his students.

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld ... news-print

Walsh does not say that Librescu saved them, the author of the story and this 'Puri' man does.

In fact, Walsh was actually outside the class, which contradicts the story that Librescu kept students away from the gunman.

Walsh says the door was barricaded by students, not by Librescu.

And Librescu was lying on the floor, so how was he protecting anyone? The promoted story doesn't hold

I see this a more judeo-supremacist self worship, where anything is deemed special when it comes to judeo-supremacists. The 'holocaust' mythology is the ultimate extension of that mindset.

- Hannover

Witness tells a hero’s story

BY MARTIN C. EVANS

martin.evans@newsday.com

; Staff writer Luis Perez contributed to this

April 19, 2007

Theresa Walsh was one of the last people to see Liviu Librescu alive.

"He looked horrified, almost as if he knew what was going to happen," said the Virginia Tech senior math major, who had stepped into the hallway from a second-floor classroom across from his at Virginia Tech's Norris Hall when she heard what turned out to be gunshots. "But he kept all the students behind him so they could get out. "

Librescu, a slightly built Israeli immigrant who survived the Nazi occupation of Romania and perished barring a classroom doorway so that his students could flee to safety out windows, was at the epicenter of the shooting rampage that claimed the lives of 33 students and faculty at the university, Virginia Tech officials confirmed yesterday.

"He's a frail man, 75 or 76 years old, who barricaded the door so his students could escape," said Ishwar Puri, chairman of the Engineering Science and Mechanics department, where Librescu was a professor.

Walsh said she saw that a lone gunman, later identified as Seung-Hui Cho, had emerged from a classroom next to the one in which Librescu taught and was moving toward him. She said Librescu was peering into the hallway at that moment, keeping his body between the gunman and his students.

Walsh said her sudden appearance in the hallway seemed to distract the gunman, who turned toward her, raised a handgun and began firing.

She said she dove back into her classroom, just as a bullet slammed into the wall next to the door. She was uninjured.

She and her classmates then barricaded themselves in, pinning a table against the door and holding onto its legs while lying on their bellies.

"After he missed, he shot through the door twice, but missed because everyone was on their stomach," said Walsh of Binghamton, N.Y. "Then he went on to the next room. You could hear shot after shot - bang, bang, bang, bang. You could hear people screaming. "

Librescu was hit at least five times and died on the classroom floor, according to Edgar Gluck, a Brooklyn rabbi who flew to Virginia to help with the ritual preparation of Librescu's body for burial.

Puri, who described Librescu as a decorous man who greeted friends with a wave and a "hallo, hallo," said Librescu's bravery helped slow the shooter, allowing other people in the department to realize that a killer was in the building, and to make their way to safety.

Puri said one other professor in the department, Kevin P. Granata, was shot dead when he came down from an office on the third floor to investigate the source of the noise, and came across the killer.

"A lot of us would not be around today were it not for our colleagues warning us and giving us more time," said Puri, who said students in Librescu's second-floor classroom jumped from windows as Librescu barred the door.

Librescu was born to a Jewish family in August 1930, in Romania. According to a cousin, Emil Simiu, of Maryland, Librescu had been a stocky, vigorous youth who took miles-long swims in the Black Sea.

The family endured Nazi persecution during the early years of World War II. His father, Isidore, a lawyer, was expelled from the bar and in 1941 was sent to a concentration camp, which he survived. Librescu and his mother went to live with his mother's family in Focsani, Simiu said.

But he was able to resume his studies after the war, and by the 1950s was considered a brilliant engineering researcher. He was encouraged when an influential Soviet mathematician wrote him for advice on solving a problem.

In 1976, a smuggled research manuscript that he had published in the Netherlands drew him international attention in the growing field of material dynamics. In the mid-1970s, he immigrated to Israel, where he became a professor at the University of Tel Aviv. He came to Virginia Tech in 1985 and lived in Blacksburg with his wife, Marlena. Puri said they had two grown children.

"He was always helping who he could," Marlena Librescu said from Brooklyn. "But he wasn't able to help himself. "

His research is said to have been critical to advances in the field of composite materials used to make strong lightweight components for modern aircraft.

"He was an absolute giant," Puri said. "I want him to be remembered that way."

Staff writer Luis Perez contributed to this story.

by Real » Mon Apr 23, 2007 11:35 am

Hannover wrote:1. Walsh does not say that Librescu saved them, the author of the story does.

2. I see this a more judeo-supremacist self worship, where anything is deemed special when it comes to judeo-supremacists.

1. Yes she does. Her description of what she witnessed was this:

"But he kept all the students behind him so they could get out. "

Had she said "and" instead of "so" there might be some doubt about what she meant.

2. Walsh? Judeo self-worship?

by Hannover » Mon Apr 23, 2007 11:55 am

Real wrote:
Hannover wrote:1. Walsh does not say that Librescu saved them, the author of the story does.

2. I see this a more judeo-supremacist self worship, where anything is deemed special when it comes to judeo-supremacists.
1. Yes she does. Her description of what she witnessed was this:

"But he kept all the students behind him so they could get out. "

Had she said "and" instead of "so" there might be some doubt about what she meant.

2. Walsh? Judeo self-worship?

How does that happen since Walsh was outside, in front of him?

How does the fact that the students barricated the door, not Librescu, show that he 'saved students'? In fact, he would have been behind them.

How does his lying on the floor 'save students'?

Yes, judeo-supremacism. Read the false glorification, by 'Walsh, Puri, Perez. There were many victims at Va. Tech, and who is it that gets singled out for praise?

- Hannover

by Real » Mon Apr 23, 2007 12:26 pm

Hannover wrote:1. How does his lying on the floor 'save students'?

2. Yes, judeo-supremacism. Read the false glorification, by 'Walsh, Puri, Perez. - Hannover

1. Where does it say he was lying on the floor?

He died on the floor.

If he was hit five times and students lying on the floor weren't hit, and the witness across the hall saw the look on his face, it pretty clear he was standing.

2. Why do you assume it's false glorification?

by Hannover » Mon Apr 23, 2007 1:38 pm

Real wrote:
Hannover wrote:1. How does his lying on the floor 'save students'?

2. Yes, judeo-supremacism. Read the false glorification, by 'Walsh, Puri, Perez. - Hannover
1. Where does it say he was lying on the floor?

He died on the floor.

If he was hit five times and students lying on the floor weren't hit, and the witness across the hall saw the look on his face, it pretty clear he was standing.

2. Why do you assume it's false glorification?

Ms. Walsh (not capable of "judeo-supremacist self worship") was across the hall (close enough to see his face). Her conclusions are probably more valid than yours or mine.

on the floor:

"After he missed, he shot through the door twice, but missed because everyone was on their stomach," said Walsh of Binghamton, N.Y. "Then he went on to the next room. You could hear shot after shot - bang, bang, bang, bang. You could hear people screaming. "

So, the door was barricaded by the students, and everyone got on the floor, Walsh got up and was shot. There is nothing to indicate he saved anyone.

It's false glorification because his 'Jewishness' is emphasized rather just being a person, along with the false claims of the 'holocaust', and the false claim that he 'saved' students. Wanna debate the 'holocaust'?

- Hannover

by Real » Mon Apr 23, 2007 2:39 pm

Hannover wrote:1. So, the door was barricaded by the students, and everyone got on the floor, Walsh got up and was shot. There is nothing to indicate he saved anyone.

2. It's false glorification because his 'Jewishness' is emphasized rather just being a person, along with the false claims of the 'holocaust', and the false claim that he 'saved' students. Wanna debate the 'holocaust'?

1. You're a tad off on your comprehension of the article

- The gunman came out of a classroom next to Librescu's.

- He stood in the doorway between the gunman and the students.

- The gunman turned to Walsh's classroom and fired.

- He then turned toward Librescu's classroom and shot him five times.

There were actually two different classrooms and Walsh was not shot. The "everyone" on the floor refers to the classroom Walsh was in, not Librescu's.

2. The story is given a sad irony by this human interest detail.

An old man, who survived another horror is slain so senselessly on a day commemorating that other tragedy.

I remember a couple years ago a Gulf War veteran came home to Detroit and was killed on the street. The fact that he was a Gulf War veteran gave the story a certain poignancy.

And I don't think anyone who read it ever thought that fact was included in order to glorify soldiers.

It's also an odd criticism that his "jewishness" is emphasized by the reporter because I don't think the skepticism about this story would also be happening if not for his "jewishness".

by Henry » Mon Apr 23, 2007 3:17 pm

I think 'Real' was indicating there was no false glorification of Ms. Walsh, not the Jewish professor.

by Real » Mon Apr 23, 2007 4:17 pm

Hannover wrote:1. So, the door was barricaded by the students, and everyone got on the floor, Walsh got up and was shot. There is nothing to indicate he saved anyone.

2. It's false glorification because his 'Jewishness' is emphasized rather just being a person, along with the false claims of the 'holocaust', and the false claim that he 'saved' students.

1. I think you're off just a tad on your comprehension of the article:

- The gunman came from one classroom and headed toward the adjacent one (Livescu's)

- Walsh was in a classroom across from the professor's.

- He took a shot at her, missed, she closed the door and the students in that classroom lay down on the floor

- Cho then turns toward Livescu who has "all the students behind him so they could escape" (Walsh's words).

Walsh and Livescu were in two different classrooms.

Walsh was not shot.

The "everyone...on the floor" refers to the other classroom.

2. Bringing up his past tragedies gives the story an ironic sadness in that he survived one horror only to die in another horror on a day memorializing the first.

I remember reading a couple of years ago about a Gulf War veteran who came home to Detroit and was killed on the street. Including his status as a veteran gave that story a similar poignancy.

But no one accused the reporter of glorifying his "soldierness", "rather than just being a person".

by Hannover » Mon Apr 23, 2007 4:29 pm

Real,

I do see that I missed some things in the story, my apologies for that.

My position has not changed however, there is no proof Librescu 'saved students'. He merely looked out of his door and is said to be a hero, when in fact (according to this article), the students couldn't have left anyway because of the gunmen. Librescu curiously gets credit for being a hero, while he really behaved rather stupidly in not just closing and barricading the door a la Walsh's class.

You have no evidence this man 'survived a horror' and have apparently chosen not to debate regarding it.

points from the article which promote the guy's 'jewishness':

- Librescu, a slightly built Israeli immigrant who survived the Nazi occupation of Romania .....

- Librescu was born to a Jewish family in August 1930, in Romania ...

- The family endured Nazi persecution during the early years of World War II. His father, Isidore, a lawyer, was expelled from the bar and in 1941 was sent to a concentration camp, which he survived. [yet another survivor in spite of claims of planned 'extermination']

- In the mid-1970s, he immigrated to Israel, where he became a professor at the University of Tel Aviv.

Combine those with over-the-top superlatives and we have judeo-supremacism sticking out like a sore tumb.

- Hannover

If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

by Real » Mon Apr 23, 2007 5:18 pm

Hannover wrote:1. Librescu curiously gets credit for being a hero, while he really behaved rather stupidly in not just closing and barricading the door a la Walsh's class.

2. You have no evidence this man 'survived a horror' and have apparently chosen not to debate regarding it.

3. points from the article which promote the guy's 'jewishness':

4. Combine those with over-the-top superlatives and we have judeo-supremacism sticking out like a sore tumb.

1. This reminds me of the ACLU second guessing a cop after a shooting.

Everyone acts differently in these situations so I wouldn't call anyone "stupid" for not closing a door. All I know is that he stood and took five shots and if anyone else was in that class they survived, so he must have done something right.

2. I don't exactly know what you mean by evidence. I wasn't there and I have no pictures.

But I'm just following a thread topic begun by someone else. I'm sure there are myriad other threads relating to the veracity of the holocaust. That's not what anyone else on this thread was discussing.

Why de-rail it?

3. I agree that his background was emphasized in the article just as that Gulf War veteran's background was emphasized in the one to which I referred. Neither had relevance to the actual story beyond human interest (do you also think there was an agenda in mentioning the soldier's status as a veteran?).

4. I still don't get this Judeo-Supremacism thing as it relates to this story and Ms. Walsh. Do you feel that Ms. Walsh would have told her story differently if the professor were Mexican?

by Hannover » Mon Apr 23, 2007 6:38 pm

Real:

I still don't get this Judeo-Supremacism thing as it relates to this story and Ms. Walsh. Do you feel that Ms. Walsh would have told her story differently if the professor were Mexican?

If this man was Mexican or anything else, I doubt if we'd get all the laughable personal information and absurd praise. Self promotion is part & parcel to the 'holocaust' Industry.

- Hannover

by Henry » Tue Apr 24, 2007 7:45 am

I have to agree with Hannover on this one, Real.

by _Mads_ » Tue Jun 19, 2007 2:09 pm

Hannover wrote:. Librescu curiously gets credit for being a hero, while he really behaved rather stupidly in not just closing and barricading the door a la Walsh's class.

- Hannover

True. The problem with this story is that it probably isn´t possible to save anybody in this way. Maybe you can win a couple of seconds for those you want to save (which is the time it takes to be shot and fall to the ground), but then that doesn´t matter anyway. There are better ways of barricading a door.

I think this is serious dangerous propaganda. It reinforces the picture of "holocaust survivors" as "very very good" (in this case heroic) people, and when you made that connection once, what are you going to say when you hear that these "holocaust survivors" are actually liars?

What the propagandists behind this want is to strengthen the tendency of most people to simply dismiss without thinking revisionist arguments, and unfortunately I think they succeeded in doing that here.

It should be noted that such a thing does not happen very often (that a person gives his life for others). When it happens, it normally involves close relatives, intimate friends etc. Why should we believe that a Jewish teacher would die for (non-Jewish?) students?

Gerdes Banned at the Cesspit

2010-01-10T05:47:00.001-08:00

It took a while but here it is:

by Moderator2 » Sun Jan 10, 2010 6:41 am
Mr. Gerdes,
You have been banned for 14 days. You didn’t read our guidelines carful enough. From viewtopic.php?t=358
No namecalling, threats, or personal attacks; period.
Keep your posts limited to one point.
Voluminous, lengthy, and redundant posts are not welcomed.
Meanwhile I'll give you the possibility to rethink your posting strategy. As it’s now, you are thrashing our forum.

Moderator 2

An enjoyable discussion ...

2009-12-30T03:39:00.001-08:00

... developed in the CODOH Cesspit when the poster "Wahrheit" launched the following challenge:

Going off of Bradley Smith's popular challenge, I was wondering if any revisionist here is able to provide, with proof, the name of a single person who was deloused and shipped off the the occupied Soviet territories (or some other resettlement area) from 'transit camp' Treblinka?

This is a very crucial question for revisionists to answer. As leading researcher Carlo Mattogno maintains:

Since Treblinka was much too small to be able to accommodate the large number of Jews deported there at the same time, the transit camp thesis is, in fact, the single plausible alternative to the conventional picture of the extermination camp. Tertium non datur - no third possibility is given.
http://www.vho.org/GB/Books/t/2.html

Unfortunately, Mattogno is not able to meet this challenge.

Greg Gerdes similarly maintains from his NAFCASH website:

THE TRUTH – Treblinka was a transit camp and the so called gas chambers were, in reality, DELOUSING FACILITIES designed to protect the health and prolong the lives of the shameless liars who fraudulently claimed to be the victims of a genocidal extermination program. Remember, there are only two options: extermination center (for those who believe in magic) or transit camp (for those who believe in the scientific method). There is no third option and only one truth.
http://nafcash.com/

Yet no names are given.

I'd even be willing to accept evidence of transports travelling from Treblinka to a specified resettlement area (no need for specific names). Surely this challenge is much easier than the similar one that Bradley Smith poses to Holocaust traditionalists, as the people in question would be alive (somewhere), and leave a much larger trace than any silent and cremated corpse.

Perhaps some witness testimony of the resettlement? Post-war memoirs of life in the newly established lands?

I'd be interested to see what everyone has to offer.

With the praiseworthy exception of "Lamprecht", the CODOH folks essentially reacted by trying to change the subject, their replies ranging from the comparatively intelligent posts of "Lohengrin" to the gibbering imbecility of Greg Gerdes' repetitive "show me/prove this and that" - rhetoric. Gerdes is obviously still haunted by his well-documented cowardice and the opponent who exposed it time and over again – self-projecting accusations such as "I'm sure Wahrheit will continue with his Muehlenkamp like cowardly evasion of all inconvenient questions and facts and refuse to answer your pertinent questions, just like he's running away from my pertinent questions" suggest that I still figure prominently in the nightmares of this deplorable subject, whose mirror-imaging of my admonishments (I have often pointed out his running away from my pertinent questions) is also duly noted.

On page 4 of the thread, the otherwise ridiculously hysterical "Gébé Tremblay" (who had earlier accused "Wahrheit" of "calomny" and of being "intellectually dishonest" - he was not the only one to come up with such crap) produced the following memorable statement:

by Gébé Tremblay » Wed Dec 30, 2009 2:04 am

Lamprecht wrote:On the contrary, Greg Gerdes, who posted in this thread, said:
"Treblinka was a transit camp"
See the full quote in the OP.

He is making the claim that it is a transit camp.

Greg Gerdes dont represent all revisionists.

While it's not exactly true that Gerdes' "transit camp" rubbish is not representative (as pointed out earlier by "Lamprecht", quoting Mattogno&Graf, and later by "Wahrheit"), it is fun to see yet another "Revisionist" true believer apparently beginning to distance himself from my old friend Gerdes (whose panicky hollering can also be witnessed on the CODOH threads Muehlenkamp and Mermelstein, Muehlenkamp does Belzec/Chelmno and The Famous THIRTY TREBLINKA QUESTIONS, by the way - among other threads mentioned in my blogs Muehlenkamp-mania in the Cesspit, So what’s happened in the Cesspit since I last looked in? and Reactions in the Cesspit ...).

Kudus to "Wahrheit" for introducing a rare breeze of common sense into the stuffy air of CODOH lunacy. I'd love to give him a hand over there, but I'm not allowed to post on CODOH (see the RODOH thread The Memory Hole Festival goes on ... for the story behind my being banned from that lovely place). And he seems to be doing fine on his own anyway.

Hargis on White Pride

2009-12-29T07:07:00.001-08:00

Here:

Some of you guys seem to want to label such things as white pride 'racist' while ignoring the fact that the 'holocaust' lie is a racist lie against those of European lineage, aka 'whites'. The promoters of the absurd 'holocaust' are racist. I see very few here who seem to realize that.

[...]

I do understand your point and we try to avoid that at this forum. But also, I think it's fair and reasonable to expect those with a European background to react to what is clearly a racist attack upon them. For every other group, racial consciousness is not only accepted, but encouraged; there should be no double standard.

The expression goes:'Those that fail to protect and nurture their own are destined to be ruled by those that do'.

Srebrenica Denial

2009-12-18T08:49:00.001-08:00

The ICMP has been carrying out out DNA analysis of the human remains of Srebrenica victims since 2001. Its results are regularly updated on its site. As of July 2009, it had revealed...

...the identity of 6,186 persons missing from the July 1995 fall of Srebrenica, by analyzing DNA profiles extracted from bone samples of exhumed mortal remains and matching them to the DNA profiles obtained from blood samples donated by relatives of the missing.

Surely this is enough for deniers to drop their evasion of the obvious truth? Unfortunately, no.

When Jonnie Hargis opened this thread in July 2005, the ICMP had already identified at least 1,042 victims. Hargis dismissed any Internet text outlining such evidence with this astonishingly ignorant remark:

Your links don't help, in fact they hurt your position, they merely show a few bones and not enormous mass graves of thousands upon thousands as alleged. Also, the text which makes claims means nothing when searching for physical evidence.

Hargis thus insisted by implication that even DNA evidence is inadmissible unless the investigators have placed photographs of each grave and each exhumed body on the Internet with proof that they were murdered.

Hargis also made this unsubstantiated claim:

I believe it was a Finnish forensics team that surmised that what dead they did find were a result of military action. The bodies contained gun powder traces indicative of weapons firing.

What Finnish team was this and how does the presence of gunpowder prove that the dead were simply victims of battle? It turns out that Hargis was conflating Srebrenica with the investigation of the massacre in Racak, Kosovo, and was misrepresenting the results, which are discussed here.

Another technique of deniers, as Oliver Kamm notes here, is to play numbers games. This can be illustrated by examining claims by the most prominent Srebrenica denier, Edward Herman.

Herman argues here that the number of refugee survivors, when compared with Srebrenica's pre-war population, makes the death total of 8,000 impossible. This, of course, is decontextualized number-mining, because it ignores population movements between those counts and does not examine the numbers in light of the other evidence, most obviously the DNA analysis. This then leads him to claim that the ICMP is (wittingly or unwittingly) examining remains that were brought in from other parts of Bosnia, as part of an elaborate and macabre conspiracy to pass off the remains of war dead as remains of massacre victims:

Interestingly, although the Serbs were regularly accused of trying to hide bodies, there has never been any suggestion that the Bosnian Muslims, long in charge of the body search, might shift bodies around and otherwise manipulate evidence, despite their substantial record of dissembling. A systematic attempt to use DNA to trace connections to Srebrenica is underway, but entails many problems, apart from that of the integrity of the material studied and process of investigation, and will not resolve the question of differentiating executions from deaths in combat. There are also lists of missing, but these lists are badly flawed, with duplications, individuals listed who had died before July 1995, who fled to avoid BSA service, or who registered to vote in 1997, and they include individuals who died in battle or reached safety or were captured and assumed a new existence elsewhere.

This crankery proves that the demands made by deniers for forensic evidence of Holocaust mass grave sites are bogus. If DNA evidence is inadmissible, there is simply no point in trying to placate such demands by disturbing the sites.

HC forum is now open

2009-12-14T03:16:00.001-08:00

The registration is by invitation, which you may get if we know you as a person who can somehow contribute to the discussion, regardless of your views on "revisionism" (you should register at Yuku first).

http://holocaustcontroversies.yuku.com

Dr. Terry says:

The HC forum is now open to the public. Members are invited to discuss the subjects raised by the Holocaust Controversies blog, including blog posts there, as well as any serious or factual issues relating to the history of the Holocaust and other genocides, their denials and negations, or related themes such as 20th Century history, conspiracy theories, antisemitism, etc.

HC Yuku is for serious discussion, and membership approval is required. We would enjoin potential members to use the same profile/username as they are currently using elsewhere on the internet, and to include a link to this profile/forum/blog/website if you are not already known to us. Membership applications from unknowns will be rejected; we are not a site for noobs, novices, JAQ-off merchants, trolls or trouble-makers. We will be a small group and hope to keep the quality of discussion high by making it so.

Reactions in the Cesspit ...

2009-12-14T02:50:00.001-08:00

... to my blog So what’s happened on the Cesspit since I last looked in?

Obviously after reading the aforementioned blog, "Revisionist" primitive Greg Gerdes, on the Cesspit thread Muehlenkamp and Mermelstein, took issue with A Holland’s post of Sat Nov 21, 2009 4:48 pm.

And he did it with the only "arguments" that sparrow-brained fanatics like him have at their disposal, like the "tens of millions of teeth" nonsense, the baseless "physically impossible" claim (more intelligent "Revisionists" than him, like Carlo Mattogno, have tried and miserably failed to demonstrate physical, technical or logistical impossibilities) and, last but not least, his pathetic "can you show me just one this and that" – howling (as to what amounts of human remains from Nazi mass murder have been proven beyond a reasonable doubt to exist or have existed in the soils Babi Yar and the Nazi extermination camps Chelmno, Belzec, Sobibor and Treblinka, by "showing" such remains or otherwise, see among others my VNN posts nos. 172, 194, 777, 1710 and 1825 and my RODOH posts nos. 10971, 11200 and 11216, as well as the HC blogs mentioning Babiy Yar, Chelmno, Belzec, Sobibor and Treblinka). Poor Greg, I can only feel sorry for the way he keeps banging his hollow head against the wall of facts inconvenient to his articles of faith.

The other rabid Jew-hater addressed in my aforementioned blog, "Dr Jew" or "Drew J", shot his bull on the thread New challenge & reward offered by the NAFH, in his post of Wed Dec 09, 2009 6:24 pm, which I shall comment hereafter.

Drew J:

You 'prove' it by citing someone's memoirs. Memoirs of someone who allegedly has no reason to lie and wants to report something that really happened so that humanity can correct the mistake and learn from it and allow it to happen...NEVER AGAIN. Incase no one noticed, this seems to be Roberto's latest answer to Greg Gerdes' challenge of providing 'just one name' of a person who died in a gas chamber.

Drew J obviously didn’t pay much attention in reading my blog "Can you give the name of just one Jew, with proof, who was gassed?" and the excerpts from and introduction and biographical note to Oscar Strawczynski’s memoir in my RODOH post # 11612. Otherwise he might have realized that Oscar Strawczynski wrote his memoir in memory of his family members murdered at Treblinka (and not "so that humanity can correct the mistake and learn from it and allow it to happen...NEVER AGAIN") and didn’t exactly go out of his way to have it published. What is more, he refused to change or edit his manuscript after the war when urged to do so, because of the frankness with which the Jewish collaboration in Treblinka was depicted, by a Jewish community organization interested in publishing the memoir. The background and intention of genuine survivor memoirs like Strawczynski's is obviously a far cry from what ignorant intellectual dwarfs like Drew J would like it to be.

As to Drew J's inevitable "allegedly", what arguments supporting this feeble claim of manipulation does Drew J have against the essential accuracy of a memoir that

a) Is matched by other eyewitness, documentary and physical evidence to the mass murder at Treblinka, including but not limited to the evidence listed in my VNN posts nos. 172, 194,777 and 1825 and in previous posts on this blogspot, and

b) Was written by someone who never behaved in a manner that would call in question his credibility, who on the contrary – as pointed out in my related blog - was found to be highly reliable when testifying at a trial before the courts of a constitutional state like the German Federal Republic, held according to the defendant-friendly procedural rules of that constitutional state?

Let's see.

Drew J

Citing another memoir from an eyewitness who allegedly saw a bunch of people who went into a large room, screamed (because of gas) and never came out again. It seems like for every 'genuine' memoir we have on record that Muehlenkamp would throw his support behind, we can always dig up another false or exaggerated memoir. The latest from Eric Hunt is just one example out of many. The fact that many have lied already and been exposed, and are probably doing a religious duty by lying to circumvent Gentiles (Kol Nidre), justifies agnosticism about these so called eyewitness memoirs. If you doubt this look at what he says about me in another blog entry.

I doubt that bigmouths like Drew J can provide demonstrably false or substantially embellished memoirs in numbers to even match the authentic and essentially accurate depositions transcribed in my RODOH thread Treblinka Eyewitness Accounts. But even if they could, or even if false or substantially embellished depositions outnumbered authentic and essentially accurate ones, what would this mean? Would this justify skepticism as concerns the factuality of mass murder at Nazi extermination camps, as described by a great many essentially reliable eyewitnesses, largely from the ranks of the German camp administration, whose descriptions are corroborated by documents and other sources of evidence? No more so than the existence of thousands if not millions of phony Vietnam veterans justifies skepticism in regard to the historical record of the US War in Vietnam.

One thing that true believers like Drew J don’t realize is that, for their articles of faith to hold true, they cannot content themselves with bitching about this or that fake eyewitness, any more than hypothetical deniers of the war in Vietnam can make a point by exposing one or the other phony Vietnam vet. What they have to do is demonstrate that all eyewitnesses to Nazi mass murder, whether survivors or bystanders or perpetrators and even if considered reliable by the courts of constitutional states like the German Federal Republic, made up their stories from A to Z. And the fact is that "Revisionists" have not only failed to tackle most eyewitnesses, but are even unaware of the overwhelming majority. Consider, for example, the eyewitnesses on whose descriptions the Düsseldorf District Court based its reconstruction of events at Treblinka in the 1965 judgment against Kurt Franz and others, as quoted in my blog More Fun With Ugly Voice Productions (Part 1):

The findings of fact in Part One are based
1. on the depositions of the defendants, insofar as they can be relied upon,
2. on the depositions, insofar as they can be relied upon, of the unsworn witnesses attorney- at-law A., salaried employee O., merchant Hä., accountant M., merchant L., company officer R., salaried employee v. He., sales representative W., emeritus university professor Dr. Pf., fitter N., tally clerk F., nurse U., locksmith D., waiter Josef Oberhauser, truck driver Erich Bauer, nurse G., Vice President of the Federal Railways Direction Kassel Z., Federal Railways leading counsel Ri., counsel St., Federal Railways director Za., train driver S., Federal Railways leading inspector ret. Pi., Federal Railways leading secretary We., train driver Sc., leading train driver K., former police counsel Hei., salaried employee Sch., master automobile mechanic Fu., janitor J., night porter Bo., mason La., counsel of the Polish State Railways Zab., salaried employee Str., salaried employee Bi., salaried employee Ra., locksmith Josef Hirtreiter, pensioner Gi., merchant Le., salaried employee Ge., locksmith Pa., textiles technician Rei., stenographer Irmgard Franz, decorator Wa., actor Th. and engineer Pos.,
3. on the sworn and credible depositions of the witnesses burner Ki., merchant Gie., merchant Ko., lecturer Wes., engineer Ley., district court counsel Schw., merchant Ja., sawmill director Raj., salaried employee Au., plumber Oscar Stra., hairdresser Bom., presser Rap., engineer Gl., hairdresser Pla., civil servant Sz., state employee Li., port warehouse clerk Ros., locksmith Tai., painter Hell., repository administrator Lak., mechanic Tu., construction technician Koh., locksmith Ku., office clerk Lew., merchant Jan., hotel direction assistant Sed., butcher Roj., deputy manager Sp., housewife Ka., butcher Wei., textiles merchant Ka., librarian Pfo., cushion maker and decorator Zi., merchant Kols., tailor Lach., fruit salesman Br., housewife Su., merchant Do., master brewer Un., manager Zygmund Stra., textiles merchant Bu., butcher Schnei. and butcher Go.,
4. on the expert opinions, all of them rendered under oath, about "SS and Police in the NS State" by the scientific consultant at the Institute for Contemporary History in Munich, Dr. Buch., about "The Persecution of the Jews by the NS Regime" by library counsel and assistant professor at Göttingen University Dr. Ser., about "The National Socialist Persecution of the Jews in the General Government" by the college lecturer at the Pedagogic Academy in Lüneburg von Krann., about "The Number of Victims in Treblinka Extermination Camp" by the Director of the Institute for Contemporary History in Munich Dr. Kraus. and about "Euthanasia and Destruction of Life Not Worth Living in the Third Reich" by Marburg University professor Dr.Dr. E., as well as
5. on the documents read out and named in the session protocols, which were available to the jury court in photocopy or transcription and the concordance of which with the originals is subject to no doubt.

Drew J may want to tell us how many Treblinka eyewitnesses are mentioned in the above translated excerpt – besides Oscar Strawczynski – that "Revisionists" have never heard of let alone attempted to refute.

In my blog So what’s happened on the Cesspit since I last looked in? I wrote the following about some of Drew J’s earlier ramblings:

Yawn. As if any HC blogger had ever written anything suggesting that he accepted the overblown Soviet estimate of the Majdanek death toll. Drew J is setting up a straw-man so obvious that one can only fell sorry for his stupidity.

And what follows is no better: after some brainless bitching about another of Sergey’s articles (also written by "Muehlenkamp", of course), he goes into a rabid tirade against all those "liars" and tops it off with a lengthy quote about his favorite guru Joseph G. Burg's testimony at the Zündel trial – because, you see, all eyewitnesses to mass killing in Nazi extermination camps are inveterate liars but a "Revisionist" fanatic's gibberish is the gospel truth, in the cloud-cuckoo-land of other "Revisionist" fanatics.

Missing another chance to cut his losses by shutting up, Drew J lashes out in defense of his idol.

Guess Roberto just can't let it go. Burg had no reason to lie except that muehlenkamp says so.

No, except that J. G. Burg (Joseph Ginsberg) was a "Revisionist" true believer who, in defense of his faith, had made claims as bizarre as those quoted in the Negationist Team 2nd Response 6/22/2004 of the RODOH forum's Auschwitz Gas Chambers Debate:

The Jewish author Josef G. Ginsburg:

These [German] war crime trials will not be a blessing for the German people. The hanging of those tried and sentenced to death by the International Military Tribunal should have made an end to this sad chapter. The victors were shortsighted and very poorly advised when they subjected the Bundesrepublik to this cruel spectacle, because the continuation of these so called war crime trials was dictated to the Bundesrepublik in the General Treaty with Germany. Germans were to sit in judgement against Germans in this vile form. This is no search for justice but a proven anti-German policy.

The opposing debating team's comment to this slobbering nonsense was the following:

With all due respect for Mr. Ginsburg and his right to utter his personal opinion - if correctly rendered by our opponents - this author seems to have been woefully misinformed about two things:

1. That it was "the victors" who "subjected the Bundesrepublik to this cruel spectacle, because the continuation of these so called war crime trials was dictated to the Bundesrepublik in the 'General Treaty' with Germany";

2. That the trials conducted by West German criminal judgment made "Germans ... sit in judgment against Germans" in a "vile form", pursuing "a proven anti-German policy" rather than searching for justice.

Regarding item 1, it should be pointed out that according to the provisions of the German Criminal Code (Strafgesetzbuch), which first came into force on 15 May 1871, German criminal law applies to crimes committed against or by German citizens. In other words, what Ginsburg believes the "victors" to have "subjected" the Bundesrepublik to results from German legal provisions that were in force long before there were any "victors" to subject Germans to anything, and started being gradually applied by West German criminal justice authorities as West Germany regained her sovereignty. The development of the prosecution of Nazi crimes by West German criminal justice is explained on the Justiz und NS Verbrechen website of the University of Amsterdam, under the link http://www1.jur.uva.nl/junsv/JuNSVEng/JuNSV%20English%20homepage.htm in an article which we highly recommend to read.

It becomes clear from this article that

i) during the years 1945 to 1952, the victors, far from forcing German to try Germans as Ginsburg would have it, limited the jurisdiction of German courts, which together with a lack of interest by German criminal justice authorities in crimes committed against foreigners led to prosecution being mostly focused on crimes committed by and against Germans on German soil;

ii) during the ensuing six years, 1953 to 1959, West German criminal justice, while restored to full sovereignty, lost interest in prosecuting Nazi crimes and limited its activities to a few "chance hits" or "leftovers" from the previous period, which furthermore resulted mostly in acquittals or stayed cases;

iii) The "reorientation" of the judiciary regarding the prosecution of Nazi crimes during the ensuing period resulted not from any foreign imposition, but from a "change in generations and spiritual climate" inside Germany;

iv) Prosecution of Nazi crimes was hampered by the West German legislative, which issued or changed legislation in such a way as to make most Nazi crimes fall under the statute of limitations when they could have been prosecuted;

v) The number of defendants whose trial ended without punishment was always considerable - roughly 50 per cent - and considerably higher than the number of defendants who were given a life sentence, even though the German criminal code mandates this sentence in case of murder.

The last of these characteristics leads us to item 2 of Ginsburg's assumptions. Aside from the West German law of criminal procedure (Strafprozessordnung) corresponding to the defendant-friendly principles of a constitutional state, the way in which both the procedural law and the material criminal law have been applied regarding Nazi crimes has been considered benevolent beyond the demands of law even by historians who expressly praise the achievements of German criminal justice, like Martin Broszat.

Quote:[...]Often reprimanded for its careful judgments, pleading for the accused or for facts not being provable in case of doubt, the judiciary of the German Federal Republic, with its voluminous investigation apparatus working over many years, has especially in the area of the extermination camps often contributed more to the clarification of this National Socialist crime complex than would have been possible to historians.[...]

The above is our translation from: Ino Arndt/Wolfgang Scheffler, "Organisierter Massenmord in Nationalsozialistischen Vernichtungslagern". Vorbemerkung von Martin Broszat. In: Peter Maerthesheimer / Ivo Frenzel, Im Kreuzfeuer: Der Fernsehfilm Holocaust. Eine Nation ist betroffen, 1979 Fischer Taschenbuch Verlag Frankfurt am Main, page 174.

Other historians and legal scholars are less gentle in their assessment of West German justice:

Quote:[...]If criminal trials nevertheless took place, the courts could not close their eyes before the enormous crimes that were exhibited before them, but they didn't want to make anyone responsible for these crimes. The judges' shyness to even call anyone a "murderer" flourished in a noteworthy manner. The Hannover County Court, for instance, sentenced an NS-perpetrator, who had committed a number of murders with his own hands, as "accomplice to murder", i.e. as a mere assistant of the murderer proper. And his superior, who had given him the corresponding orders, the court convicted merely as an "inciter". As there was no further actor between the two, the murders were factually "deeds without a perpetrator".
[...]
Against the actually convicted NS-criminals the courts often issued sentences which, according to the former Hessian General Public Prosecutor Fritz Bauer, came "rather close to mocking the victims". In the early 1960s, the German coordination council of the Christian-Jewish Society observed "since some time and with increasing concern, that the sworn courts [Schwurgerichte] of the German Federal Republic are treating mass murders and violent crimes from the National Socialist era (concentration camps, ghettoes, Einsatzgruppen etc. ... differently from other murders", that the Nazi criminals were given "minimum sentences for >complicity in murder< which, in the eyes of the general public, reduced the participation in mass murder to a crime in the order of magnitude of, say, heavy theft or professional receiving of stolen goods". One or two days imprisonment for every proven murder were not a rarity at these trials, and this was by no means only due to the astronomically high numbers of victims.[...]

The above is our translation from: Ingo Mueller, Furchtbare Juristen, 1987 Kindler Verlag GmbH, Munich, pages 250 and 257/258.

A cruel spectacle, Mr. Ginsburg? Certainly so - for the survivors of the mass murders testifying in court.

The pursuit of a "proven anti-German policy", Mr. Ginsburg? Nonsense.

The emotional Mr. Ginsburg obviously didn't know what he was talking about. And it speaks volumes for the quality of the NT's "research" that, instead of looking for scholarly assessments of the handling of Nazi crimes by West German criminal justice, they preferred to make an uninformed writer - accurate rendering of Mr. Ginsburg's utterances provided - into the "key witness" of their case against a criminal justice which, if anything, can only be accused of having applied the defendant-friendly procedural rules of a constitutional state in an exceedingly cautious and benevolent manner in favor of the defendants when it came to Nazi crimes.

As we can see, Burg was one to make claims so divorced from reality as to warrant the conclusion that he was either lying through his teeth or lived in a fantasy world where his wishful thinking and preconceived notions became reality. He was certainly not a witness to be taken at face value on anything without independent corroboration.

Drew J

Well maybe that's not fair. Perhaps we know Burg is a liar because other memoirs contradict his.

The problem is not that "other memoirs" contradict Burg’s claims as concerns Auschwitz-Birkenau, but that these claims are at odds with

a) dozens of eyewitness testimonies independent of each other, often from former SS-men and/or subject to cross-examination at trials before the courts of the German Federal Republic, a constitutional state,
b) documentary evidence corroborating those testimonies as concerns homicidal gassing at Auschwitz-Birkenau,
c) physical evidence corroborating the eyewitness and documentary evidence and
d) documentary and demographic evidence showing that hundreds of thousands of Jews were transported to Auschwitz-Birkenau and never left the place alive.

Some exhibits from this huge body of evidence are mentioned in the Veritas Team Opening Statement 4/2/04 of the aforementioned debate on the RODOH Forum.

A witness with an obvious ideological motivation like Burg, whose claims are contradicted by a huge body of evidence and have no evidence corroborating them (other than perhaps the claims of other characters with the same ideological agenda) is dismissed as a liar or a loony in the real world. Not so in "Revisionist" cloud-cuckoo-land.

Drew J

Fine but mere contrarian views aren't enough. There needs to be evidence behind them. Unfortunately, it is lacking.

An interesting exercise in double-think, considering that the "contrarian views" here are those of Drew J and his guru Burg, which are not only without evidentiary support but at odds with all known eyewitness, documentary and physical evidence.

Drew J

Especially about the gas chambers in Auschwitz, which Leuchter showed problems with, was then countered, but then which Rudolf refuted and basically enabled Leuchter to update and correct his previous work.

Drew J seems to be a more than a little slow on the uptake, otherwise he would have realized that Rudolf's "refutations" were shown to be mendacious pseudo-scientific nonsense (albeit more sophisticated than Leuchter's rather primitive crap) in several articles and an expert report written by a professional colleague of Rudolf’s:

The Chemistry of Auschwitz

Leuchter, Rudolf & the Iron Blues

Chemistry is not the Science

Report of Richard J. Green, PhD

Drew J

If Muehlenkamp and co. really cared about genuine holocaust victims, they would do their best to expose these phony memoirs like Eric Hunt is doing.

Unlike whoever this Hunt fellow is, I'm aware that every historical event or phenomenon has its phonies and wannabes and that such phonies and wannabes have little if any impact on the accurate historical record of such event or phenomenon. Hence such phonies and wannabes are not on top of my list of priorities.

Drew J

Hunt himself said he is in contact with Jews who are upset that these other Jewish liars are going to be exposed and make more people doubt the holocaust.

Mr. Hunt should tell such Jews – if existing – that only someone with manure instead of brains would "doubt the holocaust" because of one or the other phony "survivor", just like only someone with manure instead of brains would doubt that there was a US war in Vietnam because of all those phony "veterans" telling Rambo tales in bars throughout the US on a Saturday night. Drew J is kindly invited to forward my recommendation in this sense to Mr. Hunt.

Drew J

Now I say that when millions die all over Europe by murder or starving, and are taken into camps and lose their families to bullets or disease, that's a holocaust. You don't need gas chambers or six million dead for a holocaust. I have given links before to a Zundel video where he didn't deny a holocaust happened in world war two. He said it was a holocaust for all of Europe, not just Jews. But because he doesn't favour Jews, he gets into trouble.

The issue is not failing to "favor Jews", which is something I also do every time I point out that there were also millions of non-Jewish victims of Nazi mass murder. The issue is denying that millions of Jews were murdered by the Nazis through various methods including but not limited to gassing, and that they were murdered in the context of a program to wipe out European Jewry.

Drew J

Roberto still can't deal with the fact that Berg talked to Ilya Ehrenburg the six million dollar man himself and revealed under oath in a Canadian court that Ilya himself confessed to Burg that he didn't see proof of Auschwitz gas chambers and therefore by implication, no six million number.

Is that supposed to be something to "deal with"? Even if Ehrenburg had actually told Burg what Burg claimed to have been told by Ehrenburg, the evidence to mass extermination by homicidal gassing at Auschwitz-Birkenau is such that one would have to reasonably conclude that Ehrenburg must have been delirious or out of his mind when "confessing" to Burg that he "didn't see proof of Auschwitz gas chambers", assuming that Ehrenburg was one who had investigated what evidence to mass gassings at Auschwitz-Birkenau was available to the Soviets. It is far likelier, however, that either Burg lied through his teeth or his fantasy-prone mind converted what he would have liked Ehrenburg to tell him into what Ehrenburg actually told him. Burg was certainly one to mistake his own wishful thinking and preconceived notions for reality, all the more so concerning a supposed event that – like Ehrenburg’s alleged "confession" – lay decades in the past.

Drew J

Roberto not only recycles his bottles, but also his repeatidly refuted argument about Burg.

What "repeatidly refuted" argument would that be, and where is one supposed to read Drew J's repeated refutations? Readers are welcome to try finding them in my blogs The Old Chimp and his Apprentice, So how did yelping cowards "Drew J" and Greg Gerdes react ... or Muehlenkamp-mania in the Cesspit, or in any of the RODOH posts linked to therein.

Drew J continues:

Roberto continues on me,

This particular fanatic's blockheaded belief system (or his utter lack of honesty) shows most prominently as Drew J proclaims that "archaeologists" went to Treblinka and found "no evidence of soil or ground disturbance". We know what "archaeologists" he is talking about: a "Revisionist" wacko by the name of Richard Krege, who never published a report about his alleged world-moving finds because – as suggested by the analysis of his scans by GPR expert Lawrence B. Conyers and others – he must have realized that he had come upon the very soil disturbances compatible with mass graves that he had hoped not to find. And what's especially funny is that Drew J supports his claim with a link to the laughably hysterical website of his fellow cretin Greg Gerdes' fraudulent "association", from where references to Mr. Krege’s "archaeological" exploits have interestingly been removed …

Too bad he isn't as thorough as he makes himself out to be or he would realize that me and many others began to remain skeptical of where that bloody scan came from in the first place and if it really came from Krege or not. So he is making a straw man against me when he says I believe that scan came from Krege. We have no idea if it did or not anymore. Many on this board are agnostics over it. Therefore, we couldn't possibly be suffering from the cognitive dissonance Roberto accuses us of in the following way: "the scan shows soil disturbance but there still was no holocaust."

"Revisionists" are a funny lot. "Revisionists" such as CODOH moderator Jonnie "Hannover" Hargis have for years paraded the scan in question as proof that Krege had found no soil disturbances compatible with mass graves at Treblinka. Now that the scan has been held by an expert in GPR matters to probably show the exact opposite of what Krege and his fellow true believers claimed it to show, some of those true believers beat a hasty retreat into lamely claiming that the provenance of the scan is uncertain. This is nothing other than the good old Plan A/Plan B scheme that "Revisionist" charlatans tend to apply in regard to German documents. Plan A: try to make believe that the document does not incriminate the Nazis and actually supports the "Revisionist" position. When Plan A fails because the document is clear evidence to mass murder, apply Plan B and yell "forgery, forgery". Pathetic.

If, by the way, Drew J had an "agnostic" approach to the provenance of the scan, then whence did he derive his high-handed claim that "archaeologists" went to Treblinka and found "no evidence of soil or ground disturbance"? Did he blindly believe the assertions of a fellow "Revisionist" without asking what evidence supported these assertions? Between that and having based his position on a GPR scan that turned out to show the opposite of what "Revisionists" claimed it to show, I don’t know which makes Drew J look sillier.

But Drew J’s squirming gets even funnier as he tries to open himself an outlet with the following question, apparently aware that he has nothing to show for his claim that the scan did not originate with Krege:

Drew J

Even if it did show soil disturbance, how does that prove pounds upon pounds of ashes? How many square feet or meters does that scan in question cover anyway?

Drew J is shifting the goalposts now. As nobody claimed that the scan proves the number, size and contents of the Treblinka mass graves all by itself (to that effect it is just one out of many parts of the puzzle, one that further corroborates what becomes apparent from eyewitness, documentary and other physical evidence to mass murder at Treblinka), it's a moot exercise to babble about what the scan alone does not show. The point is that this scan was paraded by "Revisionists" as evidence that there are no soil disturbances compatible with mass graves at Treblinka, and that all evidence pointing to the mass murder at Treblinka and the presence of related mass graves at that place must therefore be called in question. What the scan actually does, however, is to corroborate rather than contradict the eyewitness, documentary and other physical evidence pointing to the mass murder at Treblinka and the presence of related mass graves at that place. As such the scan is a shot in the foot of "Revisionism", and the true believers' laughable attempts to now distance themselves from this evidence by disputing its provenance only make them look even more ridiculous than they do anyway.

Drew J

Too many unanswered questions about that scan and its origins has resulted in me and many others adopting agnosticism about it, not blind adherence as Roberto portrays it to be.

Says the fellow who in an earlier post claimed that "archaeologists" went to Treblinka and found "no evidence of soil or ground disturbance". Who does he think he is fooling? He seems to have problems even fooling himself.

The CODOH thread New challenge & reward offered by the NAFH continues with more gibberish by Drew J and Gerdes, also in reaction to some acid remarks by "Wahrheit", a more intelligent "Revisionist" who seems to be not unreasonably concerned with the (further) damage that primitives like Drew J and Gerdes are doing to the image of "Revisionism". These posts may later be commented in the RODOH forum's Memory Hole section.

Update, 21.12.2009:

See my RODOH posts nos. 11794, 11795, 11796 and 11797.

Quote of the day. The ship is sinking.

2009-12-09T04:47:00.001-08:00

People at CODOH forum are starting to wake up the the things we've been saying for years about the censorship by Jonnie "Hannover" Hargis there.

http://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?p=39493#p39493

Re: Dear Moderator...

by Friedrich Paul Berg » Tue Dec 08, 2009 12:46 pm

The arrogance and high-handed behavior of the "moderator" is appalling and destructive. Lots of people have, no doubt, walked away already.

Plus there's this:

Dear Moderator...

by Occam's Razor » Tue Dec 08, 2009 12:34 pm

Dear Moderator!

You deleted the thread "Is revisionism dependent upon forgery?", which was started by Wahrheit, with this justification:
This thread involves many issues which have been covered here before and should be discussed in individual threads, as the guidelines state. If any of you want the posts you made, let me know; otherwise this thread bites the dust.
Wahrheit asked a question which is, in my opinion, very relevant to revisionism. I am not aware that this question has been discussed here before. In fact I believe this is one of the most important questions for revisionists. It deals with the question how we approach problems (documents, photos) that we cannot answer or explain with certainty at the moment.

I value the time and effort that you put into this forum and I think that the guidelines for this forum make sense and should be adhered to.
But I think it was inappropriate and not very helpful to delete this thread.

There is obviously a resistance to start new threads when people are already engaged in a discussion. Most people feel it appropriate to respond inside the current thread, in the ongoing discussion. If you think such a response is inappropriate in a thread and a new thread should be started, why don't you make a comment in that thread and start a new thread or provide a link to an existing and appropriate thread, instead of deleting the whole thread without warning.

Has everyone in the thread I'm referring to responded in an inappropriate way? I think there were several replies that were very relevant and not off-topic, and that should not have been deleted. I think it is very unfair towards those who did not violate against the forum rules to delete the whole thread. And the topic of the thread certainly did not violate any forum guidelines. If you don't agree, please explain why.

The thread contained a few remarks from Wahrheit which could be interpreted as offensive or discouraging. Is that the real reason the thread was deleted? I think Wahrheit's questions are questions that every revisionists might ask himself sooner or later. Maybe there are good answers to these questions. But we will never know unless such questions can be asked here.

Now the impression that everyone gets who has doubts about the revisionist narrative is that anyone who has doubts is silenced and critical questions about the strategy of revisionists are not allowed. I am sure that was not your intention, but this impression might be the result.

Which replies were, in your opinion, inappropriate and off-topic? I replied specifically to Wahrheit's questions. In order to make my point I mentioned several examples. I intentionally mentioned them only very briefly, because I know that a more in-depht discussion of them would have been off-topic. But I felt it necessary to mention them because otherwise my reply would have been very abstract and maybe Wahrheit would not understand what I was trying to say.
Does that make sense?

Do the rules of this forum imply that any mention of a related topic, that has a meaningful connection to the topic of the thread, but could nevertheless be a separate topic, is strictly forbidden? Under this condition a meaningful discussion of many topics is impossible. With that reasoning you could probably delete 90% of all existing threads.

I agree that some replies in that thread went a bit too far, deviated too much from the topic. But not all replies. How are those that responded appropriately in the thread responsible for other forum members whose replies were off-topic? If I risk that any of my posts can be deleted just because somebody else posts a reply in the same thread that is off-topic, I lose my interest to post on this forum. It's frustrating.

Would you allow Wahrheit to ask his question again?
Was my post in that thread off-topic and / or inappropriate? Your justification for deleting the thread implies that you have a copy. Would you allow me to post it again in a new thread?

Kudos to Mr. Wilfried Heink …

2009-12-08T09:37:00.001-08:00

... for this unusually honest and almost reasonable post on the CODOH Cesspit (emphasis added):

Just to follow up. Prof. Dr. Seidler wrote back to inform me that there is no mention of any Fackelmänner Befehl on NARA Serie 429, Roll 461, confirming what Hartmann/Zarusky wrote in their IfZ article. Prof. Seidler had mentioned this Befehl in his "Verbrechen an der Wehrmacht", relying on Fritz Becker (Stalins Blutspur durch Europa…"). He, Prof. Seidler, had contacted NARA, asking them for details re. this roll. Nothing happened, thus he ordered it and found out that he had been led down the garden path by Becker. He is understandably perturbed by this, writing that this sort of thing is not helpful. Agreed, and neither is this nonsense article posted on metapedia.

Hartmann/Zarusky provide a German translation of Stavka 0428, it exists, according to them, minus the uniform part. But, the order is useful for our cause without it, Stalin ordered all villages 20-30 km behind German lines destroyed, making it impossible to determine who did what. This should at least raise some doubt as to "blame the Germans for everything". Maisky, the Soviet envoy in London, apparently told Eden, in November 1941, that it had been a hard task to destroy all that had been build up since the revolution and that millions upon millions had to be evacuated (W. P. and Zelda K. Coates, "Vom Interventen yum Alliierten 1917-1942 – Die Geschichte der English-sowjetischen Beziehungen). I’ve ordered the book and will keep interested parties posted. I could also translate the order as provided by Hartmann/Zarusky if anyone is interested.

Regards

Wilf

Hartmann & Zarusky’s article about Stalin Order 0428 («Stalin’s "Fackelmänner-Befehl" vom November 1941», in: Vierteljahreshefte für Zeitgeschichte, 48. Jahrgang 2000, 4. Heft, pages 667 to 674) is referred to in my blog Blame it on the Germans ..., which contains a transcription and translation of the order’s actual text.

The first paragraph of Mr. Heink’s above-quoted post shows that Prof. Dr. Seidler finally realized himself what his colleagues Hartmann & Zarusky found out nine years ago, i.e. that he had been led astray by a secondary source he had not bothered to check. Hartmann & Zarusky’s verdict had been the following (as above, page 671, my translation):

Despite the statement that "The original of this order has not yet been sent to the author by the National Archives" in the corresponding footnote, one cannot spare Seidler, who unlike "private historian" Becker is Professor for Recent History – meanwhile emeritus – the reproach of having taken over unchecked data from non-scientific sources and thus having lent a propaganda invention of the extreme right the semblance of scientific seriousness.

As to whether the actual text of Stalin's Order 0428 of 17 November 1941 helps the "Revisionist" cause, or any cause whatever for that matter, I'll give the word to British historian Antony Beevor, who on page 45 of his classic Stalingrad (Penguin Books, 1999) wrote the following:

A German officer described how shocked he and his soldiers had been when Russian civilians had cheerfully stripped the corpses of their fellow countrymen. Yet German soldiers were taking clothes and boots from living civilians for themselves, then forcing them out into the freezing wastes, in most cases to die of cold and starvation. Senior officers complained that their soldiers looked like Russian peasants, but no sympathy was spared for the victims robbed of their only hope of survival in such conditions. A bullet might have been less cruel.

During the retreat from Moscow, German soldiers seized any livestock and food supplies on which they could lay their hands. They ripped up floorboards in living rooms to check for potatoes stored underneath. Furniture and parts of houses were used for firewood. Never did a population suffer so much from both sides in a war. Stalin had signed an order on 17 November ordering Red Army units – aviation, artillery, ski-troops and partisan detachments – to 'destroy and burn to ashes' all houses and farms for up to forty miles behind the German lines to deny the enemy shelter. The fate of Russian women and children was not considered for a moment.

Never did a population suffer so much from both sides in a war – that describes the Nazi-Soviet conflict in a nutshell. Yet there are fanatical idiots who see evil only on one side of the conflict while eulogizing the other and denying its crimes. One such idiot must have hated his brother-in-spirit Heink's above-quoted post.

NAFCASH's Greg Gerdes: murderer von Brunn a "true American hero", his victim a "giant simian"

2009-12-08T07:39:00.001-08:00

This has already been mentioned by Jonathan here, but I think it deserves to be repeated and quoted. "NAFCASH" is a ridiculous pseudo-organization run by an ignorant, babbling neo-Nazi fanatic Greg Gerdes, who knows nothing about the topics on which he issues "challenges". It has been extensively covered by this blog. Below you can find excerpts from Gerdes' postings in just one thread at a neo-Nazi forum. Note that von Brunn was a Holocaust "revisionist", whose crazy ramblings had been approved for posting at CODOH before the shooting. Greg Gerdes' "NAFCASH" "challenge" has been joyfully embraced by the CODOH.

Emphasis mine.
http://www.vnnforum.com/showpost.php?p=1009631&postcount=1

June 11th, 2009
Greg Gerdes
Senior Member

Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,129

From what I gather, I believe it was tubular magazine .22.

Does anyone have any information to the contrary?

Does anyone know what kind of action it had?

Does anyone know what brand it was?

Does anyone know how many shots he fired? From what I gather, I believe it was about six.

Does anyone know how many times the rent a simian was hit?

Does anyone know where he was hit?

Does anyone know what brand and type of ammo Van Brunn used?

[...]

One other question - Does anyone know how big this simian was? I'm assuming it was rather large.

The ONLY solution is a white revolution.

http://www.vnnforum.com/showpost.php?p=1009653&postcount=4

June 11th, 2009 #4
Greg Gerdes
Senior Member

Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,129
[...]
So the giant simian died from at least one shot to the upper-left torso, and the 88 year old man didn't die from a shot to the head from a "service revolver."

I'll assume the "service revolver" is a .357 magnum until I learn otherwise.

Interesting stuff.

BTW, I'm not advocating that the .22 long rifle should be a freedom fighters weapon of choice. Nor am I trying to imply it's as effective as larger and more powerful rounds. I'm just saying....

http://www.vnnforum.com/showpost.php?p=1010278&postcount=16

June 12th, 2009 #16
Greg Gerdes
Senior Member

Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,129

From what I've learned to date it was:

"A vintage Winchester" .22 rimfire "manufactured sometime between 1908 and 1928."

I'm sure it would have had a tubular magazine. (They say it had 10 rounds left in it when he went down.)

Does anyone know what model it was?

Does anyone know how many shots he fired? (If he had 10 shots left, then I assume he fired about 6 rounds.)

Does anyone know how many times the rent a simian was hit? (We know he was hit at least once - in the upper torso.)

Does anyone know what brand and type of ammo Van Brunn used?

And the rent-a-cop Von Brunn killed was a 6 foot 6 "giant" simian.

The rent-a-cop's were using "service revolvers" in .38 special. And they fired "at least 8 times."

Like I said before, what was nice about this is that there was no gun with a high capacity magazine nor was there any "assault" rifle used. Nothing politically incorrect about it.

Also, Von Brunn was a "felon," so that may have had a lot to do with the type of weapon he used.

The ONLY solution is a white revolution.

http://www.vnnforum.com/showpost.php?p=1010814&postcount=20

June 13th, 2009 #20
Greg Gerdes
Senior Member

Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,129

[...]

So he killed the giant 6 foot 6 simian with just one shot to its upper left chest.

[...]

Anyway, good job Mr. Von Brunn. You are a true American hero.

The ONLY solution is a white revolution.

http://www.vnnforum.com/showpost.php?p=1012800&postcount=36

June 17th, 2009 #36
Greg Gerdes
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,129
Mark:

"Couldn't he come up with a better target?"

Absolutely not.

Going after the hoax museum was great.

NOTHING we can do will result in anything less than a barrage of negative media attention. We have to accept it and get over it. There is no alternative.

Or perhaps you can tell us how talking to the jews will help us attain our goals?

The dirty jews and their minions who have made the peaceful redress of our grievances impossible have made a White revolution inevitable.

Talk is for conversations - bullets are for change.

Trying to talk to the jews is as asinine as trying to talk to a cancer growing in your chest. NOTHING we can say to them is going to make the evil cocksuckers change their genocidal plans.

All this worry about negative press has given us paralysis.

It's damned if we do and damned if we don't.
However, do = life and don't = death.

We have NO other choice than to fight.

If we're going to die anyway, why not die fighting like men?

So what’s happened in the Cesspit since I last looked in?

2009-12-05T15:01:00.001-08:00

Not much, as usual. Just some more amusing showpieces of “Revisionist” brain damage and/or mendacity.

In his post of Wed Dec 02, 2009 8:02 pm, my good friend "Drew J" shows how pathetically obsessed he is with my humble person, as he mouths off about a blog written by Sergey Romanov as if it had been written by me.

It’s not the first time he has done this: on the thread Eleanora Hodys (which contains an interesting discussion between "Reinhard" and the more level-headed "Germania") the poor soul attributed this article of Sergey’s to "Muehlenkamp".

I must still be showing up in poor Drew J’s nightmares, as is also suggested by his harking back to discussions from the Cesspit's Muehlenkamp-mania phase on his thread Wolzek = Sobibor? Monowitz = Birkenau?.

In his latest post, Drew J starts out by making Sergey’s caveat about a recap of Demjanjuk’s history before the recent trial:

Here's a decent recap of Demjanjuk's history before this trial from them (although it gets numerous historical details incorrect, like saying that 1.5 million people were killed in Majdanek instead of about 80,000):

into this:

Interesting how he admits that millions weren't killed at Majdanek.

Yawn. As if any HC blogger had ever written anything suggesting that he accepted the overblown Soviet estimate of the Majdanek death toll. Drew J is setting up a straw-man so obvious that one can only fell sorry for his stupidity.

And what follows is no better: after some brainless bitching about another of Sergey’s articles (also written by "Muehlenkamp", of course), he goes into a rabid tirade against all those "liars" and tops it off with a lengthy quote about his favorite guru Joseph G. Burg's testimony at the Zündel trial – because, you see, all eyewitnesses to mass killing in Nazi extermination camps are inveterate liars but a "Revisionist" fanatic's gibberish is the gospel truth, in the cloud-cuckoo-land of other "Revisionist" fanatics.

This particular fanatic's blockheaded belief system (or his utter lack of honesty) shows most prominently as Drew J proclaims that "archaeologists" went to Treblinka and found "no evidence of soil or ground disturbance". We know what "archaeologists" he is talking about: a "Revisionist" wacko by the name of Richard Krege, who never published a report about his alleged world-moving finds because – as suggested by the analysis of his scans by GPR expert Lawrence B. Conyers and others – he must have realized that he had come upon the very soil disturbances compatible with mass graves that he had hoped not to find. And what's especially funny is that Drew J supports his claim with a link to the laughably hysterical website of his fellow cretin Greg Gerdes' fraudulent "association", from where references to Mr. Krege’s "archaeological" exploits have interestingly been removed …

However, there are also some moments of sanity or almost-sanity on the Cesspit. One was when a newcomer who calls himself "AHolland" asked the following question in his post of Sat Nov 21, 2009 4:48 pm on the thread Muehlenkamp and Mermelstein:

I'm sorry I am quite new to this but this question pops up in my head: Scientifically you have the obligation to consider the reversed question:

Can you show they are not the remains of human bodies smashed to pieces?

As a large part of the world (arguably the majority) does seem to accept the Holocaust, is it not the obligation of those who deny it to refute THEIR arguments instead of asking them for proof? I think this might be a more effective and more convincing approach.

Apart from the lame attempt of "tyger" to tar positions supported by all known evidence and contradicted by none with the "argumentum ad ignorantiam" brush, the response to the questions of "AHolland" was deafening silence.

Lisciotto and Webb are at it again

2009-12-05T06:05:00.001-08:00

[The fake blogs have been finally removed due to my complaint to Google/Blogger. I tried in 2006 but Blogger.com was unresponsive back then. I have saved the content of these fake blogs in PDF files (except for the comments).]

Carmelo Lisciotto of holocaustresearchproject.org has posted this message under a nickname impersonating me on a fake blog: http://promoteholocaustdenial.blogspot.com/2009/12/help-us-to-bring-down.html

Carmelo has been waging a smear campaign against this blog since 2006, after his friend Chris Webb had been caught supplying forgeries for deathcamps.org and Carmelo himself had been exposed as a thug and bigot.

Carmelo created several fake blogs back then with libelous messages. He is both a webmaster and one of the authors at holocaustresearchproject.org, from which fact one can judge the worthiness of this "project" run by such complete sociopaths.

Updates are below the cut.

Update: Carmelo also posted new messages at http://defeat2jews.blogspot.com/2009/12/seeking-help-to-discredit.html and http://sergeyisaforger.blogspot.com/2009/11/revisionists-and-debunkers-unite-we.html (the last one "downdated" to November; last time I checked it several days ago it wasn't there). Including this fake comment:

Anonymous said...

One thing you can do is now that you've put out the word is to go on your debunking holocaustcontroversies blog and claim that the HEART guys posted this blog!

That will help to discredit them!

Konrad
December 5, 2009 6:26:00 AM PST

Ha ha, how clever.

Update 2: more crap from Carmelo: http://promoteholocaustdenial.blogspot.com/2009/12/seeking-creative-ways-to-attack-carmelo.html
The guy has too much time on his hands. He better start posting ads like this one again and find someone... or something. [Sub-update: and Carmelo's reaction: http://promoteholocaustdenial.blogspot.com/2009/12/carmelo-is-gay-slaveboy.html ]

Update 3: Carmelo's shamelessness knows no bounds:

https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=26330369519182568&postID=6197803981765836822

Anonymous said...

I think we goofy'd when we vandalized the deathcamps.org website.

We should not have tried to put fake pictures and wrong information to the ARC people they are too smart.

You must also right away post on your pro-holocaust blog that they are faking you

Fritzi the rat

December 5, 2009 6:34:00 AM PST

"Fritzi the rat" is Lisciotto's nickname for Michael Peters, the German founder of deathcamps.org, whom Lisciotto tried to harass for a long time.

Update 4: more from Lisciotto: https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=4334237632808723379&postID=4530613407902071262

Update 5: Lisciotto is on a roll today: http://defeat2jews.blogspot.com/2009/12/push-forgeries-angle-on-deathcampsorg.html

Update 6: Carmelo is even more insane than I thought: http://promoteholocaustdenial.blogspot.com/2009/12/my-response-to-letter-from-carmelo.html

Update 7: CL needs serious help: http://promoteholocaustdenial.blogspot.com/2009/12/webb-watch-im-tired-of-looking-like.html

Update 8: I guess it's been a looong day for the poor thug: http://defeat2jews.blogspot.com/2009/12/why-we-need-to-steal-deathcampsorg.html

Update 9: poor Carmelo Lisciotto losing it so badly: http://defeat2jews.blogspot.com/2009/12/why-dont-i-sergey-romanov-own.html

“Can you give the name of just one Jew, with proof, who was gassed?”

2009-12-03T18:28:00.001-08:00

On the RODOH forum's thread Camps with gas chambers, our old friend Greg Gerdes, who now calls himself "thunder", is emulating another (no less obnoxious, though perhaps a little more intelligent) "Revisionist" charlatan by asking the question quoted in the heading of this blog regarding every camp mentioned in his ignorant list of "Holocaust gassing" sites (which was addressed in my RODOH post # 11608).

Gerdes will of course never make a clear-cut statement about what it is that he would accept as proof. For if he should undertake to state what evidence would convince him, he would face an unsolvable dilemma. Either he makes unreachably high demands, like asking for evidence that cannot be expected to exist in view of what is known about the mass killing and body disposal procedure at Nazi extermination camps – evidence such as an autopsy report or a document containing the names of persons expressly stated in that document to have been killed by gassing on a certain date. Or he professes to accept what by reasonable standards of evidence, such as applied by a constitutional state's courts of justice, would be considered proof that a certain person was among the victims of homicidal gassing in a Nazi extermination camp. In the former case he would make it plain that he is not interested in an answer, but only in making a propagandistic fuss. In the latter case, evidence that he would have to accept would soon be rubbed under his nose.

Let's take the example of the two little children shown on the photograph below, which was copied from the book Escaping Hell in Treblinka. Israel Cymlich. Oskar Strawczynski, edited by Yad Vashem and The Holocaust Survivors’ Memoirs Project, New York and Jerusalem 2007.

Guta (the girl) and Abus (the boy) were the children of Oskar Strawczyinski, a Jewish tinsmith from Lodz, and his wife Hannah (her husband called her Anka). This photo, also copied from the aforementioned book, shows their parents when they were married in 1932:

Guta was born in 1933, Abus in 1938. They were thus about 9 and 4 years old on 5 October 1942, when together with their parents, their grandparents they arrived at Treblinka extermination camp in a transport from the Polish city of Czestochowa. The arriving deportees were separated, men on one side, women and children on the other. Oskar Strawczynski was selected as a worker on account of his tinsmith skills, while his parents, wife and children were taken to "Camp 2", from where they never returned. What had become of them Strawczynski didn't take long to realize, the details of how people were killed in gas chambers in "Camp 2" and their bodies disposed of being later revealed to him by fellow inmates.

The source of the above information about the fate of Oskar Strawczynski's family is Oskar Strawczynski's memoir, the translation of which from Yiddish is partially transcribed after the aforementioned book, together with an introduction and biographical note from the same book, in my RODOH post # 11612. This is how Oskar Strawczynski, in his memoir written in a forest hideout during the spring and summer of 1944, described the last he saw of his loved ones:

It was the day after Sukkoth, October 5, 1942. The morning was bright and sunny. Although utterly exhausted after 24 hours in the tightly packed cattle cars, we shivered with terror when the train stopped and we heard frightful shouts: "Out! Out! …" Whips fly over our heads … In the eyes of my wife I recognize that finally even she has begun to believe the horrible rumors about the gas factory beyond Malkinia. I can see that now she regrets not having agreed to my plan to hide with the children in our neighbor’s hideout. She could not bring herself to believe all the malicious talk. She had wanted to believe that as long as we were together, no evil could reach her or our dear children.
We run out as fast as we can to avoid the whips lashing overhead and find ourselves on a long, narrow platform, crowded to capacity. All familiar faces – neighbors and acquaintances. The dust so tremendous, it obscures the sunlight. A smell of charred flesh stifles the breath. I catch a glimpse of the mountains of clothing, shoes, bedding and all kinds of wares that can be seen over the fence. But there is no time to think … The dense mass of people is pushed toward and jammed through a gate.
At this moment I have just one thought, not to lose my dearest ones in all this chaos. I succeed in keeping together with my wife, my two beautiful children, my mother and father. Little do I know that these are our last moments together, that behind the gate we would be torn apart and we would never see one another again.
[…]
Beyond the gate, we find ourselves in quite a large square with barracks on two sides. Opposite the fence and the gateway through which we had passed is a fence with a small entrance in the corner. This is the gate to the "Avenue of Death", which leads to the "baths" in Camp 2. Down this avenue, completely naked, they took their last walk: my dear wife and children, father, mother, brothers and sisters, together with millions of Jewish men and women. They never came out of the "bath". Their sacred bodies were heaped on stretchers and thrown into the infernal fires.
Later, when I was working on the rooftops of Treblinka, I had many opportunities to watch the last walk of our naked, unfortunate people: Mothers holding their little ones in the arms, older children at their sides, young girls with their hair already shorn, covering their breasts with their hands; or several together, arms linked, all running as quickly as possible through the row of Germans and Ukrainians, who laugh at them and mock them. Quite often, one or another of the victims was struck on the head with a whip or rifle butt and collapsed in a stream of blood. Those were horrible scenes from hell.
I return to the moment when we entered the so-called Transport Square. As we take our first steps, we hear shouts that freeze our blood. I stop thinking or feeling. We know only one thing. These are our last moments together. The shouts become louder and more penetrating: "Men to one side, women to the other."
We are completely confused by the lightning speed and terrible noise. I do not, I cannot, say a single word, not even a final farewell to my loved ones. I just hear the sigh of my beloved wife and her last words: "That’s it." No one can know how much despair and anguish those words contained. To me, they are the abyss of sorrow. I still hear those words ringing in my ears and I will surely not forget them to the last moments of my life.
Writing these words, I once again relive the sorrow of our parting. I cannot express the feelings raging within me. Fresh tears well up and the warm forest ground soaks up the hot stream from my eyes.
But there, on that sorrowful transport square, there is no time for tears or feelings. I scarcely have time to hand my wife the carefully hidden blanket for the children. A brutal hand grips my shoulder and I am hurled to the other side of the square. I manage to stay with my gentle father. The place is packed with people. On one side are women and small children; on the opposite side, men, forced to kneel. In the middle there are SS men, Ukrainians with weapons in their hands, as well as a group of about 40 men with red armbands. These are Jews, the detachment of "Reds." In Treblinka slang, they are called the "Hevra Kadisha" [Burial Society]
Kapo Jurek, the leader of the "Reds", had been a Warsaw rickshaw driver so corrupt and debauched, no deed was too foul for him. This brute would not hesitate to take aside a girl, already naked, on her march to the "bath". Promising to save her, he would do the worst, and then push her back into the line. He dressed elegantly, as that sort of person could easily afford to be in Treblinka. He works his whip on Jewish heads frequently and with gusto. As foul and corrupt as he was, his language was even worse. The vernacular of the Warsaw underworld was nothing new in Treblinka. There were great artists in that field, but no one could surpass Jurek. In short, he was quite a notable member of Treblinka’s aristocracy. Most of the "Reds" were recruited from the Warsaw underworld and did not fall short of their Kapo.
Most prominent among all in the square is a German officer, a stout man with a trimmed beard, mounted on a beautiful brown horse. He moves haughtily on his horse in the middle of the square. At a certain point, he turns towards the kneeling men and shouts: "Craftsmen, out!" A number of men step forward. Most of them, however, are sent back. Only a few are taken aside, where an SS man makes a further selection, and divides the remaining men into groups of three. I am kneeling beside my father. My mind is completely blank. No feeling, not a thought. I do not even say a single word to my father.
Among the men with the red armbands, I notice a familiar face. At first I cannot recall who he is, but then I recognize him. It is Aaron Berliner, a worker from the Czestochowa Jewish Community. He too has noticed me. He motions me to come over to him. I stand up, take my father's hand and try to take my bundle as well. He orders me to leave my bundle, and orders my father to kneel as before. Aaron leads me to the mounted German. The German looks me over and asks: "What’s your trade?" "Tinsmith," I say. He motions me toward the selected group, to which Aaron leads me. Now I am completely alone, also parted from my father, without a kiss, without a single farewell …
The group grows to about 60 men, no women. A man of about 30 approaches us. He is tall and broad with strong muscular legs and black hair, a young giant. This is Kapo Rakowski. He shouts a command and leads us away in military formation. As we march through the remaining mass of people, I scan the women’s side. Perhaps I can catch a last glimpse of my loved ones; perhaps I will see my two little angels again. I do not find them; probably they are in the barracks.
We are led to an enormous square, piled with mountains of bundles. In the distance is a tall embankment on which a watchman saunters back and forth, his rifle at the ready. From behind the embankment, thick smoke bursts forth as if from a volcano.
[…]
The crowd passes through and there is silence for a few minutes. Suddenly a smothered mass scream is heard from the distance. "Ah-ah-ah…" The scream does not last long; it becomes weaker and weaker until it dies away. I know instinctively that this is the last cry of the unfortunate, condemned victims, among them my own, my loved ones. Again I break into hysterical tears.
After every transport I heard this same last cry, which makes by blood run cold.

Like other survivors separated from their families upon arrival in an extermination camp, Oskar Strawczynski didn't see his wife, children and parents die in the gas chambers. But there could be no doubt for him that they were dead, because he never saw them again after they were taken to "Camp 2", because he saw the smoke of the fires burning in "Camp 2" and smelled the stench of burning flesh, and because fellow inmates who had worked in "Camp 2" later described to him what he briefly mentioned in the above-quoted passage and later in more detail, i.e. how the people taken to "Camp 2" were killed and their bodies disposed of:

While we in Camp I were busy building and beautifying, the work of exhuming and burning the bodies of the first victims of the Warsaw ghetto continued intensively in Camp 2. There were a few tremendously huge mass graves, each one filled with tens of thousands of murdered people. The layers of corpses were covered with chlorine. At the beginning, the chlorine used to arrive in wagonloads. The bodies were now being dug out and burnt in order to erase the evidence. It was not an easy job. For many months, three bulldozers growled away from 4 o'clock in the morning until nightfall. The work went on with great intensity, in two shifts. The bulldozers would constantly dig up earth mixed with body parts. The body parts had to be carefully picked out and taken on wooden carriers to be burnt in the great ovens. When one of the mass graves was emptied, the earth was replaced and carefully smoothed over, to give the appearance that nothing had ever been there. The Germans would celebrate by bringing whiskey and drinking a toast – "Until the last Jew" – and would finish up with a three-gun salute.
The graves could never be emptied entirely, because blood mixed with water accumulated at the bottom. Motorized pumps were set up to draw it out. However, they could never manage to drain the bottom few meters, and so the graves were simply covered over.
Over in Camp 2, there was also the bath … It was a large, concrete building standing on a cement platform. On its roof, visible from a distance, was a wooden Star of David. Running through the middle of the building was a corridor. The entrance was covered with a red curtain. Off the corridor were doors leading to small cubicles into which the arrivals from the transport were introduced. Outside, over the platform were large openings covered by panels hinged at the top and fastened with steel bands. Inside the cubicles, smooth tiles covered the slightly slanted floors and halfway up the walls. On the ceiling were mounted a few shower-heads. There was also a small window in the middle of the ceiling [of each cubicle].
As mentioned before, the people leave all their belongings in Camp 1. Everyone is undressed there. The women, already naked, are seated on a long bench and their hair is cut off. This is accomplished by about 40 barbers. The hair is then cleaned with steam, using a steam kettle brought especially for this purpose. The hair is then packed in bales, and sent out along with the clothing and other wares.
The victims come into Camp 2 already naked and shorn, and are immediately squeezed into the cubicles. There is no more division. Men, women, and children are all pressed together in the small cubicles so tightly that this alone would be enough to suffocate them. The doors are hermetically sealed, and the motors start to work. The air from inside is sucked out, and fumes from burnt gasoline are forced in. The cries from inside can be heard for about 10 minutes, and then it becomes silent. The entire process, from the arrival at the camp to the oven, lasts only about half an hour. Most of the victims in the cubicles start to hemorrhage.
A German controls the progress of the "work" through the little window in the ceiling. When he is sure that everyone inside is dead, he opens the side panels, and the corpses fall out onto the cement platform. An elderly Jew from Czestochowa, known as "the dentist", checks the bodies for gold or metal teeth, which he pulls out. The bodies are then piled onto stretchers and carried to the oven, where they are flung into the fire and burned. The blood that has collected in the cubicles streams out into specially dug ditches.
The "bath" contained 10 cubicles: four big ones and six smaller ones.
As I mentioned before, we in Camp 1 were strictly forbidden to enter Camp 2. If anyone crossed over into Camp 2 by accident, that's where he had to remain; there was no return to Camp 1. I received the information about the arrangements and procedures in Camp 2 mainly from Herszel Jablkowski, a solid and decent man, with whom I worked for many months in the workshop; he as a [black]smith and I as a tinsmith. He arrived at Treblinka on June 18, 1942, a considerable time before the first transports. According to him, the first transport arrived on Tisha B’Av in 1942 (July 23). He participated in digging the first mass grave. At that time, there was no bulldozer. Later, as a smith, he was employed in building the "bath". It was all one camp then. The day before the first transport arrived, Camp 1 and Camp 2 were divided. As a skilled tradesman, Jablkowski was sent to Camp 1. I also received some information about Camp 2 from Szymon Goldberg, a carpenter from Radomsko, who worked in Camp 2 for four months. He escaped during the uprising and we met in the forest 10 months later.

Oskar Strawczynski's above-quoted descriptions of what he experienced himself as an inmate in "Camp 1", and of what he learned from Jablkowski and Goldberg about procedures in "Camp 2", are generally accurate. His description of the gas chamber building's features, for instance, tallies with descriptions provided by other eyewitnesses (inmates, Ukrainian guards or SS supervisors) independently of Strawczynski. His express mention of three "bulldozers" (probably a mistaken translation of the Yiddish term used by Strawczynski to describe the excavators shown on photographs taken by Treblinka’s second-in-command Kurt Franz - corroborates and is corroborated by Alex Bay's analysis of Kurt Franz’s photographs in Bay's article The Reconstruction of Treblinka, namely the following conclusion (my emphasis):

The most basic fact that can be determined from the ground photos is that there were two, and probably three excavators in use at Treblinka. (see Figure 40).

And it is noteworthy that Strawczynski and his sources were among the few witnesses to mass murder in Treblinka who realized that the gassing was done with gasoline exhaust and not – as described by several other Treblinka witnesses – with diesel exhaust.

There are also some inaccuracies in Strawczynski's above-quoted account. Witnesses are usually not perfect observers, especially when it comes to traumatically violent events, and Strawczynski was no exception to the rule. Thus, for instance, he had an exaggerated idea of the number of Treblinka’s victims (estimated as at least 731,600 by the Central Commission for Investigation of German Crimes in Poland and at least 780,863 by Polish historian Jacek Andrzej Młynarczyk), unless he was referring to Nazi extermination camps in general when he wrote that his family had taken "their last walk" down the "avenue" to the gas chambers "together with millions of Jewish men and women". But then, how could any Treblinka inmate have made a fairly accurate estimate of the number of people killed in Treblinka? One should also bear in mind that many people have no precise notion of the meaning of numbers and may thus use the term "millions" not in a literal sense but just to convey the idea of an enormous order of magnitude. (This applies even to some historians, according to Matthew White, who in research for his Historical Atlas of the Twentieth Century occasionally got the feeling «that some writers use numbers as pure rhetorical flourishes. To them, "over a million" does not mean ">106"; it's just synonymous with "a lot"»). Oskar Strawczynski and his sources may also be forgiven for having mistakenly assumed that the air was sucked out of the gas chambers before "fumes from burnt gasoline" were forced in (what actually happened, as pointed out by the editor of Strawczynski’s memoirs in a footnote, was that the effect of pumping the poisonous exhaust into the gas chambers was to replace the air there). And it is not a mistake at all that they referred to the roasters used for burning the corpses as "ovens". It is a mere difference in lexicon: survivors would often call the pyres in Babiy Yar, Sobibor and elsewhere "crematoria", "ovens" and "furnaces", all the while describing them as pyres (thanks to Sergey for this input). Ukrainian guard Pavel Vladimirovich Leleko talked about "furnaces", and yet his detailed description of the devices used to burn the corpses at Treblinka helped me to accurately reconstruct the features of these devices, especially as concerns the presence of a pit underneath the rails on which the bodies were placed, in which the fire to make the corpses burn was ignited (see the blog Belzec Mass Graves and Archaeology: My Response to Carlo Mattogno (4,2)).

In sum, what inaccuracies are contained in Oskar Strawczynski’s account of his arrival at Treblinka extermination camp and the killing and body disposal procedures at that place are no reason to put in question the essential accuracy of that account. The stated date on which the Strawczynski family arrived at Treblinka from Czestochowa, 5 October 1942, can be checked against the evidence used by Yitzhak Arad to put together the deportation statistics in his book Belzec, Sobibor, Treblinka. The Operation Reinhard Death Camps, according to which about 40,000 Jews were deported to Treblinka from Czestochowa between 21 September and 5 October 1942. There is no indication whatsoever that Strawczynski's parents, his wife Hannah and his children Guta and Abus survived the war, or that they got out of Treblinka alive, or even that they survived the day on which Strawczynski last saw them. Thus the only argument that "Revisionists" might have to dismiss Strawczyinski’s account as a collection of lies and Strawczynski as a "lie-witness" ("Revisionists" are fond of such idiotic word concoctions) would be some evidence that Strawczyinski was a person prone to telling lies, and moreover a liar so degenerately immoral as to falsely claim the murder of his wife and his two little kids. Is there such evidence?

The best place to find such evidence would be an assessment of Strawczyinski's testimony at a trial held before a court of a constitutional state according to a constitutional state's defendant-friendly procedural rules, in which such court as well as prosecutors and defense attorneys had the opportunity to gain a first-hand impression of Strawczyinski as a witness and to cross-examine him as they considered necessary. Oskar Strawczyinski testified as a witness at the trial of Kurt Franz and others before the Düsseldorf District Court. So, what does that court's judgment tell us about Oskar Strawczyinski behavior when testifying and his reliability as a witness?

I translated the following excerpts from the judgment (emphases are mine):

During an evening roll-call SS-Hauptscharführer Küttner called the number of an inmate who had for some reason caught his attention during the day. The inmate was tied to the beating rack and beaten by Küttner and the defendant Franz on the naked behind. Thereafter Franz and Küttner announced that this inmate would be shot in the Lazarett. At their orders the beaten man was then immediately brought to the Lazarett and shot there. This incident, which was described by the witness Oscar Stra. under oath, has been established to the jury court's conviction. The witness Oscar Stra. made an objective, truth-loving impression on the court. He immediately recognized the defendant Franz. As he also said favorable things about some of the German guards, such as the defendant Suchomel, there is no reason for assuming that he could subjectively or objectively have said something false. Although the witness did not himself see the shooting in the Lazarett, this has also been established to the court's conviction. That the beaten man was in fact liquidated in the Lazarett is suggested by the fact that Franz and Küttner announced his imminent shooting during the evening roll-call. Besides the witness never saw the man again after that evening roll-call. As the Lazarett was a place where people were shot in the neck, this only allows for the conclusion that the beaten man was shot there.

Although Miete denies this deed, it is proven by the testimony under oath of the 58-year-old tinsmith Oscar Stra. from Montreal, who himself witnessed how Miete addressed Galitzarski, selected him and took him to the Lazarett. On the other hand the witness didn’t see the shooting proper in the Lazarett. Yet he pointed out that he thereafter never again saw Jakob Galitzarski, who was a personal acquaintance of his, in the camp. This allows for concluding that Miete actually killed this inmate. In any case the extensive taking of evidence made known no case in which an inmate taken by Miete to the Lazarett for shooting remained alive.
The witness Oscar Stra. correctly described the German camp personnel, especially including the defendant Miete, and the camp's installations. He strictly distinguished between what he had observed himself and what he had been told by other inmates. As he reinforced his quiet and objective deposition with the oath, there are no misgivings about giving him credence.

These findings of fact are based on the defendant’s deposition, insofar as it can be accepted as accurate, and on the testimonies under oath of the credible witnesses Gl., Un., Do., Raj., Oscar Stra., Pla., Sed., Ku., Wei., Au. and Lew.

In his interrogation under oath the tinsmith Oscar Stra. accurately expounded that Suchomel made an effort for better feeding of the gold and court Jews and that he treated them well within the range of his possibilities. As Oscar Stra. was himself a court Jew he can correctly judge this. The witness finally pointed out that Suchomel was called "the good German" by the gold and court Jews, a designation that according to the results of the taking of evidence was given to no other German SS-men by the witnesses.

The witness Su. was furthermore certainly mistaken insofar as she stated that Suchomel "very often" beat inmates on the roll-call square. Many reliable witnesses, among them Gl., Un., Pla., Oscar Stra., Raj. and Wei., declared the contrary, that Suchomel never beat anyone outside the processing of transports.

Suchomel denies to have killed one or even more of the gold Jews. He points out that during his stay in Treblinka of the small detachment of gold Jews only the gold Jew Stern was killed, for which he could not be held responsible (see Section A.VI.15. of Part Two of the reasons for the judgment, where the death of gold Jew Stern is described).
This defense of the defendant Suchomel is confirmed by the witnesses Oscar Stra., Gl., Tai., Koh., Sed. and Lew., all of whom the jury court considered especially reliable.

That Suchomel treated his gold and court Jews well is proven by the sworn witnesses Gl., Un., Do., Raj., Oscar Stra., Pla., Sed., Ku., Wei., Au. and Lew. and has been already demonstrated in detail in Section F.II.2. of the Second Part of the reasons for the judgment. On the other hand is has been described in detail in Section F.II.1., on hand of the depositions of the witnesses Gl., Tu., Kols., Oscar Stra., Do., Tai. and Koh., interrogated under oath, that Suchomel could also be brutal during the processing of the transports, by beating the Jews who had arrived and were meant for extermination with the whip and in a few cases also using his firearm, in order not to be considered by his superiors and comrades a weakling and loser.

These are not the only mentions of Oskar Strawczyinski in the judgment, but I think they are sufficient to show that the court had a most favorable impression of this witness as an objective and fair man who differentiated between the horrors he had experienced and the gentler behavior of some SS-men, namely the defendant Suchomel. Strawczyinski’s care in distinguishing between what he had seen or heard himself and what he had learned from others also shows in the above-quoted excerpts from his memoir, in which he expressly mentioned the sources of what he knew about "Camp 2".

So what we have is the memoir of someone who everything indicates to have been a highly reliable witness, which includes a first-hand description of how that witness's loved ones were separated from him and taken to a place from which they never returned, which was part of a camp that all known evidence – including but not limited to that witness’s memoir and testimony and to other evidence listed in my VNN posts nos. 172, 194,777 and 1825 and in previous posts on this blogspot – shows to have been an extermination camp for Jews, a place where Jewish people were taken for no other purpose than to be killed there, mainly by gassing in the part of the camp to which the members of Oskar Strawczyinski's family were taken.

That being so, what reason is there not to consider it proven beyond a reasonable doubt that Oskar Strawczyinski’s parents, his wife Hannah and their children, nine-year-old Guta and four-year-old Abus, were killed in a gas chamber at Treblinka on 5 October 1942?

"Revisionists" may want to seek refuge in the formal-legalistic argument that the late Oskar Strawczyinski's memoir would not be admissible as evidence in court, so let’s take a look at whether this is really so.

Section 250 of the German Criminal Procedure Code(Strafprozessordnung - StPO) establishes the rule whereby, if the proof of a fact is based on the observation of a person, such person shall be examined at the main hearing, and the examination shall not be replaced by reading out the record of a previous examination or reading out a written statement. The reason for this rule is obvious: as concerns assessment of a witness account's credibility, nothing beats the court's gaining a first-hand impression of the witness through direct, face-to-face interrogation. Therefore, directly interrogating the witness is what must be done if it is possible. However, sometimes direct interrogation by the court is not possible, because the witness is no longer alive or because there are insurmountable hindrances to the witness's appearing in court. For such cases, Section 251 of the StPO contains the following provisions, among others:

(1) Die Vernehmung eines Zeugen, Sachverständigen oder Mitbeschuldigten kann durch die Verlesung einer Niederschrift über eine Vernehmung oder einer Urkunde, die eine von ihm stammende schriftliche Erklärung enthält, ersetzt werden,
1. wenn der Angeklagte einen Verteidiger hat und der Staatsanwalt, der Verteidiger und der Angeklagte damit einverstanden sind;
2. wenn der Zeuge, Sachverständige oder Mitbeschuldigte verstorben ist oder aus einem anderen Grunde in absehbarer Zeit gerichtlich nicht vernommen werden kann;
3. soweit die Niederschrift oder Urkunde das Vorliegen oder die Höhe eines Vermögensschadens betrifft.

My translation:

(1) Interrogation of a witness, expert or co-accused can be replaced by the reading of an interrogation record or a document containing a written statement of the witness, expert or co-accused in question,
1. If the defendant has a defense attorney and the public prosecutor, the defense attorney and the defendant agree to it;
2. If the witness, expert or co-defendant have died or for some other reason cannot be interrogated by a court within a foreseeable time;
3. Insofar as the record or document concerns the occurrence or the amount of a pecuniary damage.

Alternative 2 is the one that applies here. As Oskar Strawczyinki is dead (he died in 1966) and his memoir is a written statement of his, it would be permissible to read the memoir into evidence at a present-day criminal trial before a German court.

In Anglo-Saxon legal systems there is the so-called hearsay rule, which is guided by more or less the same reasoning that underlies Section 250 of the StPO:

The theory of the rule excluding hearsay is that assertions made by human beings are often unreliable; such statements are often insincere, subject to flaws in memory and perception, or infected with errors in narration at the time they are given. The law therefore finds it necessary to subject this form of evidence to "scrutiny or analysis calculated to discover and expose in detail its possible weaknesses, and thus to enable the tribunal (judge or jury) to estimate it at no more than its actual value".[3]

Rule 801 of the US Federal Rules of Evidence defines hearsay as «a statement, other than one made by the declarant while testifying at the trial or hearing, offered in evidence to prove the truth of the matter asserted». Strawczyinski's memoir would thus qualify as hearsay if it were to be introduced at a trial or hearing as evidence to the facts we are concerned with here – the death of Oskar Strawczynski's family members at Treblinka extermination camp –, and according to Rule 802 it would thus be inadmissible as evidence to these facts at such trial or hearing unless any of the hearsay exceptions provided for in Rules 803, 804 or 807 applies.

Rule 803 contains exceptions to the hearsay rule that would make the introduction of Oskar Strawczyinski's memoir as evidence admissible even if he were alive and available to testify at the trial or hearing in question. My understanding is that the exceptions that could possibly or arguably apply in this case are the following:

• (5) Recorded recollection: if Oskar Strawczynski were available to testify but presently had insufficient recollection of the events in question;
• (16) Statements in ancient documents. Statements in a document in existence twenty years or more the authenticity of which is established: Oskar Strawczynski’s memoir was written more than sixty years ago, and its authenticity is established and could be specifically confirmed for the trial or hearing in question by expert examination or by the testimony of Strawczynski or a family member familiar with the memoir;
• (19) Reputation concerning personal or family history. Reputation among members of a person's family by blood, adoption, or marriage, or among a person's associates, or in the community, concerning a person's birth, adoption, marriage, divorce, death, legitimacy, relationship by blood, adoption, or marriage, ancestry, or other similar fact of personal or family history: Oskar Strawczyinski's parents, wife and children are reputed dead by Oskar Strawczynski, as expressed in the memoir.

But Oskar Strawczynski is dead, so it's moot to ponder what hearsay exceptions would apply if he were alive and able to testify about the murder of his family. The memoir clearly qualifies as an exception to the hearsay rule according to the following provision of Rule 804 (emphasis mine):

(4) Statement of personal or family history. (A) A statement concerning the declarant's own birth, adoption, marriage, divorce, legitimacy, relationship by blood, adoption, or marriage, ancestry, or other similar fact of personal or family history, even though declarant had no means of acquiring personal knowledge of the matter stated; or (B) a statement concerning the foregoing matters, and death also, of another person, if the declarant was related to the other by blood, adoption, or marriage or was so intimately associated with the other's family as to be likely to have accurate information concerning the matter declared.

The makers of the FRE obviously considered information about the death of blood relatives or other family members to be generally trustworthy.

Even if none of the hearsay exceptions according to Rules 803 or 804 applied, Strawczynski's memoir could still be admitted as evidence at a US trial or hearing according to Rule 807.

So it doesn't look like either the German Criminal Procedure Law or the US Federal Rules of Evidence would keep a competent court under either legal system from accepting Oscar Strawczynski's memoirs as evidence to the death of Oscar Strawczynski's family members at Treblinka extermination camp.

It's also not like names of victims of the Nazi genocide of the Jews – whether killed in extermination camps, by mobile killing squads or by other means – are a rarity, even though the identity of millions of victims remains to be established. The percentage of Jewish mass murder victims whose names are known differs considerably among the various countries of origin, depending on how complete the records available in each country are and what effort authorities and researchers in a given country made to establish the identities and individual fates of their Jewish citizens killed by the Nazis (see Dr. Nick Terry’s article Arolsen: AAARGH, all those names.... for details).

The Dutch authorities did the best job in this respect: they managed to record the names of all Jewish citizens of the Netherlands killed by the Nazis, mostly in extermination camps. Auschwitz-Birkenau was the main destination of Jewish deportees from the Netherlands, but a total of 34,313 Dutch Jews arrived at Sobibor in 19 trains between 5 and 6 March and 23 July 1943. 18 survived. To what extent the individual fate of these and other deportees to Sobibor has been reconstructed is becoming apparent these days at the trial against John Demjanjuk before the Munich District Court, as the following translated excerpts from articles in SPIEGEL magazine may illustrate. Emphases are mine.

From the article Mutmaßlichem Massenmörder Demjanjuk droht Anklage in Deutschland:

Demjanjuk is accused of having during the time of his service participated in the murder of at least 29,000 Jews – most of them women, children and old people. Almost all were killed still on the day of their arrival.

Among the victims – and this is important for an eventual indictment in Germany – there were about 1,900 German Jews. "Due to the charges we are confident that a trial against him can be held in Germany", says Schrimm. It is now possible for the first time, according to Schrimm, to mention the victims with their complete name and birth date. The eldest victim, who died on 23 April 1943 in the gas chambers, had been a 99-year-old Jew from Holland. In all deportation trains, according to Schrimm, there were babies and little children, who were gassed immediately after arrival at Sobibor.

From the article "Die Menschen sollen nicht vergessen":

19 of the joint plaintiffs have been called as witnesses and will travel to Munich when the trial begins. If things go according to plan they shall be heard within the first three days of the trial.

Others follow the trial from far away, in the Netherlands, in the USA, in Switzerland or Israel. All joint plaintiffs have lost close relatives, parents, brother and sisters or spouses, sometimes the whole family. According to the recovered transport lists they died in Sobibor extermination camp in occupied Poland, murdered in those months of the year 1943 in which Demjanjuk was presumably used there as guard by the SS.

From the article "Gefühllose und unbarmherzige Gesinnung":

The opening of the taking of evidence starts, over many minutes the Presiding Judge reads out names, birth and death dates of Jewish men and women who were deported in 1943 from the camp Westerbork in the Netherlands to Sobibor. There are many names, each one of them is a close relative of the joint plaintiffs, fathers, mothers, brothers, sisters. Some joint plaintiffs wince when the names of their relatives are read.

And then there are folks asking "Can you give the name of just one Jew, with proof, who was gassed?", as if that were a clever and pertinent question ...

Holocaust deniers who love forgeries

2009-12-02T15:09:00.001-08:00

As I have already explained once, whenever a Holocaust denier whines about "Holo-forgeries", (s)he is actually projecting - it is Holocaust deniers who have been caught relying on forged documents.

The neo-Nazi "revisionist" guru Fritz Berg crows at The Cesspit about Stalin's order 0428. And yes, he throws some "ifs" around, but the name of the posting is without any qualifiers: "Stalin's "Torch-men-Order" #0428 confirmed by Russia".

Of course, as Roberto explained long ago, although there was such an order, the specific text quoted by deniers is a blatant forgery. Thus there are no "ifs" about it. But expect these lemmings to quote it over, and over, and over again.

"The Climate Swindle vs. the Holo-Lie"

2009-11-30T15:59:00.001-08:00

Some RODOH Holocaust deniers' reactions to the latest manufactured "Climategate" nontroversy are interesting. Here's the old Nazi-Canadian Wilfried Heink:

Similarities between the "Great Climate Swindle" and the "Great Holo-Lie", taken from "timesonline":

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/environment/article6936289.ece

"[T]his weekend it emerged that the unit has thrown away much of the data. Tucked away on its website is this statement: "Data storage availability in the 1980s meant that we were not able to keep the multiple sources for some sites ... We, therefore, do not hold the original raw data but only the value-added (ie, quality controlled and homogenised) data." (True for "The Holocaust", as well, besides, archives are still locked)

If true, it is extraordinary. It means that the data on which a large part of the world's understanding of ("The Holocaust") climate change is based can never be revisited or checked. Pielke said: "Can this be serious? It is now impossible to create a (real Holo body count) new temperature index from scratch. [The unit] is basically saying, 'Trust us'." (Are you listening, nickterry?)

WHERE does this leave the ("Holocaust") climate debate? While the overwhelming belief of scientists is that ("The Holocaust" happened) the world is getting warmer and that (Germans) humanity (are) is responsible, sceptical voices are increasing.

Lord Lawson, the Tory former chancellor, announced last week the creation of the Global Warming Policy Foundation, a think tank, to "bring reason, integrity and balance to a debate that has become seriously unbalanced, irrationally alarmist, and all too often depressingly intolerant" (this is yet to happen re. "The Holocaust").

Lawson said: "("The Holocaust") Climate change is not being properly debated because all the political parties are on the same side, and there is an intolerance towards anybody who wants to debate it. It has turned ("The Holocaust") climate change from being a political issue into a secular religion."

But, the time will come when "The Holocaust" will also fall by the wayside.
Arme True Believers, armes Deutschland.

Then there's this, by another lemming:

Nick Terry always likened Global Warming Denial to HD when he was trying to tar us all with the brush of lunacy and conspiracy mania. I think GWD and HD sit together very comfortably. I say screw the totalitarian liberals and their desperate desire to control thought.

Yikes!

Update: there's more!

Nick, in case you haven't noticed, 'public policy' is determined by special interests, mainly those of an an international banking elite. You now want the same people to create a new market resulting from cap-and-trade which they can use to extract a new tax from the gullible workslave, and you want extra powers for governments to impose their authority and tax raising powers over a rapidly collapsing middle class in the name of a new global panic (one that will make the war on terrah look pretty tame once it gets rolling).

If a scientific consensus does exist, it exists for the same reason that a consensus over the Holocaust exists in the hallowed corridors of academic historiography. If we as a people, a nation, are to accept that man-caused GW exists then we need a proper national debate on this subject, since the outcome of that debate will fundamentally change the future trajectory of public policy for generations and should transform the economic and material basis of our national existence. Such decisions should not be made behind closed doors. Such decisions should not be made by corrupt, self-interested academic groupings that exist and thrive thanks to the funding they receive for affirming a pre-determined hypothesis and that pursue active policies of concelament, dissemination, and underhand conflict tactics against their enemies.

A real debate on Global warming and its consequences and its implications for public policy has not been had. Whether you could awake the masses sufficiently to watch and join such a debate is of course unlikely given that they have been controlled and dumbed down by a media that has little interest in promoting free thought.

Your Global warming paradigm, along with your war on terrah paradigm, and your 'what is in the interest of the bankers, is in the interests of us all' paradigm, are all part and parcel of a manufactured consent perpetuated by a power structure at the apex of which stands the truth of truth, the holy of holies, your sacred Holocaust religion, and the good war that was fought in its name.

I'm happy to embrace the idea of MMGW, but a debate about it must be had in the open, and in a climate of intellectual honesty. MMGW is fast on its way to becoming another article of faith that is only questioned by 'social pariahs', 'sociopaths', 'conspiracy theorists', and perhaps eventually 'the kind of people that deny the Holocaust' (oh sin of sins). Real debate is closed down. There is no open society here, but hegemonic 'truths' force fed to us through power structures that have agendas very much at odds with the creation of thriving, open societies. I object to the methods and the process, not the conclusions (which are not settled yet, since a real debate has not been had). But you wouldn't understand that since you have positioned yourself at the centre of faith promotion in the most filthy of all businesses - Holotale promotion, and you believe that 'deniers' and 'conspiracy therorists' should be silenced and those that 'know' the truth should be allowed to impose their will on society in the name of a higher 'good'. Such is the stuff that Totalitarian Liberalism is made of.

Update 2: Now compare this to a "mainstream" AGW denier's rhetoric (courtesy of Tim Lambert):

Most of the environmental movement is composed of innocent Gaianists, but not all of it. There's a hard core that's sort of a zombie remnant of Soviet psyops. Their goals are political: trash capitalism, resurrect socialism from the dustbin of history. They're actually more like what I have elsewhere called a prospiracy, having lost their proper conspiratorial armature when KGB Department V folded up in 1992. There aren't a lot of them, but they're very, very good at co-opting others and they drive the Gaianists like sheep.

Update 3: and now the CODOH deniers chime in!

Climatecaust or Hologate, that is the question?

by Kiwichap » Thu Dec 03, 2009 1:29 am

I have to laugh at how much the jack boot sale of global warming inversely resembles the hoax. This from Katherine Goldstein; Huffington Post.

"The verdict on global warming is in -- it's caused by humans and it is happening and nothing in the emails remotely challenges that.... we thought we should set the record straight... Everything else is "rumors, lies and insinuations."

Shades of Deborah Lipstadt - 'no debate'. There is no climategate and there is no 'hide the decline'. Don't be a climate denier. There is not enough time to explain it to you. The ocean will be lapping at your front door if you don't do what we $$$ay...

I hear this spirit of speech every day now, It's everywhere; and it's increasing. Self puffed-up, they think they can spit any sort of BS at us and we will just do what they say. We are not worthy to contribute data because we are deniers of the scam.

The blurb rants hypocritically about a hack, when we all know it was a LEAK (BBC).

Three cheers for the leaker. Some folk are loyal to a higher law, where TRUTH is more important than BS legalise fiction, and it pays better at the end of the day. Katherine Goldstein doesn't understand that. Am I surprised?

Then:

by Halo » Thu Dec 03, 2009 7:03 am
Thanks for this thread kiwi. Thought awhile if I should start one on the climate lie thats collapsing right now in front of our eyes...

It´s not as if the people wouldn´t have been warned of the things to come, 911, Afghanistan, Iraq, WMDs, USS Liberty... the list of collapsed (-ing) lies is so long. I can´t understand why so many are so stupid.

In case someone missed it (I know that in the US there has been some newscoverage on this topic in the mainstream media, contrasting europe- where this is not mentioned at all - at least I havent come across any report on the falsified e-mails or the collapsing man-made climate change lie except for a short mention from the BBC, who tried to spin it into a hacker scandal and internet security issue lol).

In general I might use the opportunity to hint the kind reader to a great website:

www.whatreallyhappened.com

This is really one of my most frequented websites on the web, covering climategate, obama, 911, up to "dum dum portrayal of evil"- this site has no taboos and it´s really an awesome source to inform oneself.

Thanks Kiwi for the thread

Yet another H.E.A.R.T. attack (yawn)

2009-11-20T14:26:00.001-08:00

[Update: Lisciotto and Webb have also created several fake impersonating blogs, click here to learn more.]

Chris Webb has a ridiculous piece up on his site, "Holocaust Remembrance. A time to memorialize, debate, debunk or debauch?" ( http://www.holocaustresearchproject.org/essays&editorials/memorial-debunk-debate-debauged.html ) by a certain "Dr. Martin Friedhaus". Google search has nothing on this alleged "Dr.". Whether he is real, or a creation of Chris Webb or his flunkies, the article is a hoot. It is painfully obvious that it is aimed at us.

Some quotes:

However we've also witnessed the evolution of the revisionist counter movement or "Holocaust Revisionist Debunkers" and if you think the Holocaust Deniers seemed kooky or paranoid in their methods, then the "Debunkers" can be simply downright psychotic in the way they approach the debate.

[...]

It is believed that some of these Holocaust Controversy type blogs are in fact supported by Neo-Nazi organizations with the sole purpose of subterfuge, false propaganda and personal attacks.

[...]

Are the "Debunkers" any different than the "Deniers" because they appear to take the moral high ground?

"Friedhaus" also cites Webb's article "Holocaust Denial & Debunking" ( http://www.holocaustresearchproject.org/essays&editorials/deniers&debunkers.html ), which contains assertions such as:

In addition, those self proclaimed “Debunkers” of revisionist theories are in many ways no different than the Deniers themselves. Most are only seeking a conflict or debate to engage in, and debunking revisionism affords them some sort of “moral high ground” to do it from.

[...]

And no matter what – the Deniers views are unlikely to change and does the world doesn’t really need “Noble-Debunkers” to keep the rest of us safe from such idiotic theories or treatises.

[...]

"What is Holocaust Denial & Debunking Good for?”

“Absolutely nothing!”

So the alleged "Dr. Friedhaus" and Chris Webb trash the work of such debunkers as Deborah Lipstadt, Michael Shermer, Robert Jan van Pelt, the Holocaust History Project team and many, many other noble people - all in order to smear us.

The problem is that both Webb and his flunkie (or alter ego) "Friedhaus" have neither moral nor intellectual standing to pass such judgments.

Sure, Webb's cheap psychologizing is funny in light of him allowing "Friedhaus" to call him a "Renowned Holocaust Scholar Chris Webb" in the article. This shows only that Webb has a huge ego, but ask any Holocaust historian, and (s)he will not know anything about any "renown Holocaust scholar Chris Webb".

Let's not forget who Chris Webb is. He is the guy who was dumb enough to introduce to the Action Reinhard Camps site team several forged documents. The documents were forged by "Andy Schmidt", Webb's shadowy pal and co-author (go to the Wiener Library online catalog and type in "Webb" as the author).

After the forgeries had been exposed, Webb, using his position as the registrar of the deathcamps.org domain name, seized the control over the ARC site and single-handedly purged everyone opposed to his methods, which included most of the original ARC team, including two ARC founders. Since then he has been falsely claiming that the copyright on the ARC materials belongs to him. How so? Well, apparently because he owns the domain name.

At ARC/H.E.A.R.T. sites/blogs you will see notices claiming that the copyright information can be verified through WHOIS service. The problem is that it is another blatant lie: WHOIS service only shows the owner of the domain name. It cannot, in principle, be used to establish the copyright-owner of the materials on any site.

Not being content with the Stalinist purge of the opposition, Webb, with the help of his faithful thug Carmelo Lisciotto, began to falsify the materials on the deathcamps.org site. Just one small example will suffice. While an ARC member, I authored a page about Babiy Yar Sonderkommandos, using mostly Russian-language sources and several English-language publications. Here's the archived version, where I am listed as a source. And if you go to to the current version at http://www.deathcamps.org/occupation/bywitnesses.html you will see Chris Webb as a source instead of me.

There are dozens of such "small" falsifications all over the deathcamps.org, including the history page, in which now only Chris Webb is mentioned by name as the website creator (the actual webdesign work was always done by the ARC founder Michael Peters; Webb was merely a secretary and one of the contributors). And this behavior again can only be described as Stalinist. First purge the opposition, then falsify history and destroy memory. I will not be surprised if after reading this, Webb will tell Lisciotto to further modify the record here and there.

Many ARC members became victims of such an approach. John Ulrich Poulsen had a very informative page about the slogans like "Arbeit macht frei" on the gates of concentration camps. It was a very popular part of the site, getting most of the hits. After Poulsen demanded for it to be removed (after months of trying to ask nicely), the following notice appeared instead of the site ( http://www.deathcamps.org/websites/JUPremoved.html ):

John Ulrich Poulsen "Photos of Gates and Mottos Pages" deemed inappropriate and removed from the Genuine Action Reinhard Camps website.

Due to a high volume of emails we've received stating the John Ulrich Poulsen Concentration Gates & Mottos pages offer no value to the viewer other than to symbolize and to glorify the Nazi Concentration camp system, the ARC Trustees have revisited the Independent websites and determined that the John Ulrich Poulsen pages in fact maintain no relevant connection to the events of Action Reinhard. Furthermore, the ARC Trustees’ concede that views expressed by visitors regarding these pages can be understandably & reasonably construed. Henceforth, in keeping with the spirit of memorializing the victims and survivors of the Holocaust, any promotion of such views are deemed inappropriate.

The John Ulrich Poulsen pages have been removed from the genuine ARC website.

We would also like to take this time to apologize to anyone who may have been offended by the John Ulrich Poulsen pages. -ARC

In fact, ARC never ever got a "high volume" of any e-mails, much less the ones complaining about Poulsen's popular site. But Webb and Lisciotto have a very poor fantasy, so when they removed Michael Peters' artwork from the site, they gave the same false reason for the removal ( http://deathcamps.org/websites/removed.html ):

Michael Peters Holocaust Artwork Removed due to complaints regarding content and quality
Due to the overwhelming volume of complaints we've received regarding the Michael Peters Holocaust Art pages as "being in poor taste". The ARC trustees have agreed to comply with the wishes of our supporters, and those that refer to the genuine ARC website www.deathcamps.org as a high quality digital reference and resource on the Aktion Reinhard Camps.
We would also like to take this time to apologize to anyone who may have been offended by the Michael Peters art.

-ARC

When Konrad Wawryn, author of several graphic reconstructions, demanded that his work be removed from the site, Webb removed Wawryn's work. Instead, he added this note:

Visual Dramatization removed for inaccuracies.

This visual work had been accepted as accurate by Webb just several months earlier.

After raping the deathcamps.org site, Chris Webb and Carmelo Lisciotto went on to create their own hilariously inaccurate and sloppy holocaustresearchproject.org. Unfortunately for them, they've been banned even by Wikipedia after Carmelo spammed the links to their "resource" all over wiki.

"Friedhaus" has also something to say about our alleged profanity:

In my own experience most of the "Debunking" tends to occur on conspiracy websites or "cheesy blogs" which specifically attempt to design there look and feel with an intent to perpetrate an air of credibility, and scholarship. They do this by associating themselves with respected Internet sites via web-links or reference quotes, despite the fact they often intersperse these links among paragraphs of profanity, name calling, threats and disparaging comments.

The problem is, the H.E.A.R.T. webmaster and thug Carmelo Lisciotto is one of the most profane people I've ever known. I will not repeat the messages he left at the blog and sent by e-mail, as they're truly vile. I will simply link here and here. Judging by his language, Lisciotto is also a big homophobe. I think such potty-mouthed bigots should stay away from the topic of the Nazi mass murder for obvious reasons.

"Friedhaus", if he is a real person (which I doubt) is knowingly associating himself with Webb and Lisciotto and thus has no standing whatsoever to criticize anyone.

How these people, who have no honor and no shame, can be moralizing about anything? How can the person who does not care about the truth, the copyright-thief, forgery-enabler and friend of vile bigots be trusted with educating the public about the Holocaust? It's a travesty.

NAFCASH and CODOH - A Public Embarrassment for HD

2009-10-22T09:12:00.001-07:00

Since 2005, CODOH has publicly endorsed NAFCASH's bogus challenges, such as here. It allowed a Gerdes sockpuppet to claim here that "the members of NAFCASH have put their money where their mouths are." Yet it now transpires that NAFCASH had no members and that it continued to issue challenges on the NAFCASH site despite not having the status it claimed, as can be seen here and here. A Gerdes sockpuppet called Craig Curtis has attempted to excuse these facts here. Readers can make up their own minds about his sincerity from those replies. Bradley Smith and Jonnie Hargis may like to ponder how silly their endorsement of this charlatan makes them look.

UPDATE: As Dave Woolfe points out here, Gerdes congratulated Von Brunn.

Muehlenkamp-mania in the Cesspit

2009-10-05T12:10:00.001-07:00

So apparently, Muehlenkamp has been to Sobibor; Belzec: a fraudulent excavation; My email reply from Greg Gerdes; Things have changed for me... [OR MAYBE NOT]; Muehlenkamp does Belzec / Chelmno; The Famous THIRTY TREBLINKA QUESTIONS;
Some more from Roberto; Treblinka study by Krege.

It seems that I have become the Cesspit's most bitched-about black beast, thanks to two particularly demented creatures pathetically obsessed with my humble person, "Drew J" and Greg Gerdes a.k.a. "Pepper".

I must figure prominently in those sorry punks' nightmares, judging by the number of threads in which they go yelping "Muehlenkamp this, Muehlenkamp that" and by how they even attribute to me blogs written by Jonathan Harrison, such as this one.

If Drew J and Gerdes are this hysterical already, what will become of them when they read my RODOH comments to some of their imbecilic mutterings?

The "Famous THIRTY TREBLINKA QUESTIONS"

This little Drew J freak seems to be really pissed about me …

Chicken challenge to Greg Gerdes

Further nonsense from Drew J and Gerdes (more from the former than the latter, who is capable of little other than repeating his cowardly "show me just one this and that" - yelping ad nauseam) will be dissected as time permits.

In the meantime, it will be fun to watch the old chimp and his apprentice freaking out a little more.

Update, 07.10.2009, 16:48 GMT

Cowardly liar Gerdes reacted as I thought he would. See my RODOH posts nos. 11495 and 11496.

Update, 10.10.2009, 20:18 GMT

Drew J is still the moron who shoots himself in the foot, Gerdes still the bitching fish-wife without testicles. See my RODOH posts nos. 11503 and 11504.

Update, 11.10.2009, 17:50 GMT

Kabbalistic ku-klux-klown Drew J increasingly insane, Gerdes as mendacious and gutless as ever. See my RODOH posts nos. 11507, 11508, 11510, 11511, 11512 and 11513.

Update, 12.10.2009, 17:22 GMT

Same as yesterday, plus Gerdes freaking out over Drew J. See my RODOH posts nos. 11518, 11519 and 11520.

Update, 13.10.2009, 12:47 GMT

See my RODOH posts nos. 11524, 11525 and 11530.

Update, 18.10.2009, 21:18 GMT

Gerdes: See my posts nos. 11546, 11547, 11549, 11556, 11557 and 11574.

"Drew J": See my posts nos. 11573 and 11580.

Scan Scam Sends Nazi Fan Into Full Nutter Mode: Lunatic Gerdes Takes Over the CODOH Asylum

2009-10-04T10:45:00.001-07:00

Below are three extracts posted by Greg Gerdes in the last few days. They show him in his full nutter glory.

Firstly, when Drew J posted links to past HC blogs such as Nick's Jürgen Graf is a Liar, Gerdes accused Drew J of perpetrating a lie simply by posting the link and inviting comments:

Says the liar who was caught red handed falsely accusing Graf of lying while citing professional liar Nick Terry as his source and maliciously concealing evidence that proved his false accusation wrong and proved that it was in fact Nick Terry who was the liar and is now trying frantically to cover up the fact he's been caught telling a malicious lie.

[...]

Liar.

You falsely accused Graf of being a liar.

Your first comment was:

"Jürgen Graf is a Liar"

And you even commented on your own comment:

"He sure is"

So what would that be called?

A double lie?

Secondly, Gerdes has been frantically trying to show that this scan did not come from Krege, even though it is published on sympathetic denier sites. Gerdes rants:

There isn't an ounce of proof that the photo is of a scan taken at Treblinka.

Lamprecht

Krege only said it was from Treblinka's mass graves

Now you're flat out making things up.

Krege never said that THAT PHOTO was from Treblinka.

If you're not lying, then let's see the proof of what you just said.

Lamprecht

We have videos of him scanning the area, and he gave this photo, claiming it was the result.

And now you have just spewed another bald faced lie.

You're really digging yourself in a hole Lamprecht. You just said in the previous sentence:

I said I do not know where the scan is from - and I don't.

Then you say:
[Krege] gave this photo

With the obvious implication that the photo came from Krege himself.

My what a poor liar you are Lamprecht.

Lamprecht

No, I do not have proof of him actually scanning it.

Well then, you're finally admitting the truth. But if you don't have proof, then why did you say Krege himself "gave this photo, claiming it was the result?"

Contradiction after contradiction.

Lamprecht

The odd thing is that Krege concluded, from his scan, that there were no mass graves @ Treblinka

What's so odd about that Lamprecht?

His exact words from the video were: "After 3 weeks work the team had found nothing. No graves, no ash..."

And his exact words quoted in the IHR article were: "Historians say that the bodies were exhumed and cremated toward the end of the Treblinka camp's use in 1943, but we found no indication that any mass graves ever existed," he says. "Personally, I don't think there was an extermination camp there at all."

No graves and no ash.

If that's such an "odd" statement Lamprecht, then please tell us where we might find graves and ash at Treblinka.

Look at the first photo that appears in this thread and tell us:

How many graves and how much ash are in sections A? B? C?

Pepper

Can you trace that photo back to Krege's actual GPR?

Lamprecht

How would I do that, Pepper?

Don't bother Lamprecht, I just did the work for you.

I knew something didn't smell right.

Gerdes then goes into full conspiraloon mode against his fellow denier jnovitz:

Is jnovitz David Irving?

Who but a rodohoaxer, a jew or David Irving woud say such a thing?

It never occurs to Gerdes to ask why Irving and other deniers would publish this scan had it not come from Krege. Instead, he seriously believes that attacking his fellow deniers in this manner will win him friends and influence people.